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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Phantom by Peter Eggink (97 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Dr Spektor
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Well, peter promised a video full on to show it in real time situations - yet nothing has come forth. Just returned from holidays and will likely find my phantom waiting at the post office - glad I ordered from penguin as they are great in returns and refunds..... I am surprised at the other merchants singing this thing praises....guess I'll find out tomorrow if my experience mirrors the rest here
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
pegasus
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Quote:
On Aug 27, 2015, paw wrote:
Hey Guys -
Patrick From Murphy's here.

I think this is one of those products that everyone is going to want once they know how it works. It's basically self working, you can apply it to so many different routines/effects.

Borrowed items? no problem! no body hook-ups, etc. this is really a cool 007 type thing.

Great work Peter!

Dominic : Patrick is spot on here. Even if you play with magic for your own personal fun and never perform, you will love the gimmick, it's genius. If you do perform, then I'm sure you will be using this at gigs!

James Conti :
So! Phantom! God, the trailer got me excited. I was lucky enough to have Peter send me a unit, and in the meanwhile, get to check out the streaming/downloadable tutorial video that accompanies the gimmick. And my initial thoughts are - this is AWESOME!





p
Mejais
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"I think this is one of those products that everyone is going to want once they know how it works" ...

Wax blob in the middle of a deck of card and a string attached to a pen... yeah I totally want that!

Sad I already ordered it and its shipping Smile I should have waited for more reviews. I thought the seller would be honest since the sites had a good reputation. I will learn from my mistake for sure.
markhitton
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Quote:
On Sep 7, 2015, Ustaad wrote:
Quote:
On Sep 7, 2015, Ross W wrote:

Mark Traversoni (Saturn UK) has been unusually quiet on this one! It was he who devised the excellent handling for Peter Eggink's Haunted.

Can we deduce he is keeping a diplomatic silence?


Quote:
On Sep 7, 2015, Saturn UK wrote:

I have been watching this thread with interest but have not posted before because I guess some would say as a dealer you would say that...but here goes.

I am of the option reading the ad copy that it it correct.

Some are saying there is thread but reading the ad copy as pointed out already the ad copy says no invisible thread.
If you asked me to supply you invisible thread you would not expect to receive the item used, it is thread but not what we call invisible thread that many fear.

The problem is many have read this to mean no thread, I'm sorry to point this out but this is not the fault of the ad copy.


In this modern cyber information age, the creators and distributors still think that we (the magicians) can be easily fooled and taken for a jolly good ride by their so called clever advertising and hype campaign. Well they might have deceived a few but certainly not all. And now you come in and try to justify and teach us the difference between a Thread and an Invisible Thread? Mark, I am sorry to say that your above statement has only added insult to injury. Pathetic.

And you need to remember & keep in mind what you said, and may I please quote:-

Quote:
On Sep 7, 2015, Saturn UK wrote:

. . . reputations are soon lost.


Smile



I totally agree ,well said.the Traversoni explanation is a bad trial to justify a poor marketing operation.
No thread means no thread stop playing with words is irritating enough
Smile
markhitton
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Quote:
On Sep 7, 2015, pegasus wrote:
I agree with Ustaad. No one can defend this particular add. It is deceit in its worse form. Shame on the producers of this effect.



Yes me too
Smile
Sean Giles
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This is a genius method... for getting rid of all those Hole gimmicks that didn't sell Smile
normative
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You know it's bad when the best defense of the ad copy anyone can muster is semantic hairsplitting on par with "well, technically I didn't SLEEP with your sister... we were wide awake the whole time!" You can get a whiff of bad conscience even in the instructional video: "This is totally motivated! <Strikes ludicrously awkward pose> Spectators will find this totally natural!" I suppose I'll probably hang onto mine on the off chance I come up with some sort of off label use for it, but at the moment I'm hard pressed to imagine what effect it could accomplish that wouldn't more elegantly & reliably be accomplished by other methods.
reignofsound
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Be good to see Peter's full performance video on this.
Paul S Wingham
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Review

I'm disappointed. Firstly, with myself for not waiting until reviews came in from regular people with no vested interest in the trick's success. Secondly and more importantly I am disappointed with the creator for releasing this effect with the video it was released with and to a lesser extent; the ad copy.

To be clear and fair; it does work (or at least the haunted deck and rising card do - more about genie later.

If the adverts had shown the pen awkwardly in his hand then I could have made an informed decision and that decision would have been to not give this effect a second thought. However; you didn't. So; what I thought I was buying was a way of doing the haunted deck / rising card without invisible thread but still very cleanly. Now as someone who doesn't entirely trust thread; this seemed like a great addition. In reality of course, you get rid of the thread (on a technicality) and introduce a pen with perhaps not technically elastic but certainly something that behaves like elastic and you also have to hold the pen in this weird way. I often tread carefully and I invite a response, but in my opinion, this clever filming was done so purely to deceive because in truth, I don't think many people would trade a look that is invisible, for a pen being held in your hand; and that is why I am so annoyed.

Now; I said this works and if you can justify holding the pen and your audience don't do the obvious thing of wanting to see the pen in your hands, then you can perform a version of rising card and haunted deck. However; genie is very very hit and miss; to a point where the beauty of it is lost by the reliability. let me explain. Genie is a cool trick in theory and certainly looks cool in the demo (without pen in hand), but its a trick that needs to be done with a borrowed bottle. However, it's very temprermental. you need a certain type of bottle, and by that, I don't mean a cola or pepsi bottle, I mean something else. The issue is that bottles are throw away mass produced items and subsequently quality even within brands varies. So; to do Genie, you would have to ask to look at the bottle, test it out a bit and then decide whether to perform or not. Not particularly practical to say "no; sorry, it's not the right kind of borrowed bottle".

So in summary; this is my new worst purchase of 2015. Quite a claim from a man who bought Change. However; one thing that change can do, is a) amuse my kids and b) provided me with a modicum of amusement playing with the cards. This does neither.

So there you go. In my opinion, a blatant attempt to deceive people in to buying a rubbish version of a classic trick and a version that adds nothing to the genre.

Question is; at a time where barely a week goes by with dodgy ad copy; what can we the consumer do to stop it?
RNK
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Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, Paul S Wingham wrote:
what can we the consumer do to stop it?



It would help if people quit pre-ordering. Then probably less people would get bitten by the snake!!
Dazzler UK
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Catch 22. We either pre-order and hope for the best. Or wait for some reviews to flood in and take a risk that the product is awesome and everyone will want one so it sells out everywhere and you cant get one for love nor money - Cube 3 for example.
There are two rules for success..... 1. Never reveal everything you know.
RNK
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If you are one that likes to pre-order and end up unhappy with your purchase should not complain. Everyone is WELL AWARE of deceiving ad copies in today's world.
Jon Allen
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Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, RNK wrote:
Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, Paul S Wingham wrote:
what can we the consumer do to stop it?



It would help if people quit pre-ordering. Then probably less people would get bitten by the snake!!


I am sure we have all met someone who says they don't like magic because the last magicians they saw was terrible or embarassed the person. Same goes with new products.

Not all new products are bad; not all trailers are deceitful.

Pre-ordering might seem like a gamble but that depends on whether you trust the supplier and whether they will offer a refund if what you receive is not what was advertised in either method or effect.

Personally, I will be happy to offer someone a refund if what I advertise either in video form or ad copy is proven to be blatantly deceptive towards the buyer or a downright lie. How about asking for a commitment from the person you are pre-ordering or buying from for the same? I'd be more than happy to do so if asked.

Pre-orders can be a very important part of bringing a new product to market. There should never be a blanket ban on it due to a few misdemeanours.
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Dazzler UK
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Agreed RNK that's how they get us by the short and curly's. Based on the ad copy phantom should be 'sold out' and people may have had to wait a while to get one. So you either take the plunge and possibly end up dissapointed or wait longer to get one if its awesome and you can be patient.
Unfortunately I wasnt patient enough and was dissapointed. In this case I learnt the hard way so I'll kick myself and move on but to be fair it wouldnt stop me from purchasing another effect by peter because if its a good effect and practical I don't care if my aunties neighbour created it. So no hard feelings here, as I've only got myself to blame.
There are two rules for success..... 1. Never reveal everything you know.
RNK
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Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, Jon Allen wrote:
Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, RNK wrote:
Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, Paul S Wingham wrote:
what can we the consumer do to stop it?



It would help if people quit pre-ordering. Then probably less people would get bitten by the snake!!


I am sure we have all met someone who says they don't like magic because the last magicians they saw was terrible or embarassed the person. Same goes with new products.

Not all new products are bad; not all trailers are deceitful.

Pre-ordering might seem like a gamble but that depends on whether you trust the supplier and whether they will offer a refund if what you receive is not what was advertised in either method or effect.

Personally, I will be happy to offer someone a refund if what I advertise either in video form or ad copy is proven to be blatantly deceptive towards the buyer or a downright lie. How about asking for a commitment from the person you are pre-ordering or buying from for the same? I'd be more than happy to do so if asked.

Pre-orders can be a very important part of bringing a new product to market. There should never be a blanket ban on it due to a few misdemeanours.


Jon- well said. I think that would be a fantastic idea! A disclosure from the creator/distributor that a refund will be offered if what is advertised is false or as you put it, "if what you receive is not what was advertised in either method or effect."

And I do agree there are FEW creators that you can trust. But the list keeps getting shorter. As to your statement, "There should never be a blanket ban on it due to a few misdemeanours". Well- there are ONLY a few you can trust now.

Also, can you please tell us why pre-ordering is a "very important part of bringing a new product to market"?
Paul S Wingham
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Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, RNK wrote:
If you are one that likes to pre-order and end up unhappy with your purchase should not complain. Everyone is WELL AWARE of deceiving ad copies in today's world.


So its my fault the creator sold this in the basis of a video that basically omits the fact a pen has to be held? As it goes I only bought this as it was relatively cheap and I had a voucher code over bank holiday; otherwise I wouldve waited. However I still think the onus is on the creator to be honest and the video is simply dishonest in my opinion. The ad copy is probably just about honest on a technicality.

The thing is that magic is niche and without pre orders a lot of tricks would never see the light of day so in my opinion its not fair to say "pre orders are bad". All I can do is act by a) not buying anything from peter again and b) make sure this sort of thing isn't forgotten or overlooked. Therefore expect to see me harping on about this anytime a new release comes up.
jimesw
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Can people not just send it back for a refund? If I bought a can of baked beans and there was peanut butter inside I'd send it back.
PRINCE
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When it arrives, just send it back for a refund under the distance and selling act - that's last resort if the seller won't just cancel the pre order and simply refund you.
magicman29
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Anyone notice the gap in between the two halves of the deck for the haunted deck explaination, it was like 2-3mm! lol
If peter ever does get back to this thread I've one question for you... if (before phantom was created) you saw a magician doing a rising card/haunted deck/ghost in a bottle effect while holding a sharpie in an awkward position in the same hand as the deck would you be suspicious of the sharpie, honestly?

Kieran
Ustaad
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Quote:
On Sep 8, 2015, Sean Giles wrote:

This is a genius method... for getting rid of all those Hole gimmicks that didn't sell Smile



Smile Smile

Smile
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