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TheDirectionalist Special user I predict that I will have this many posts when you read this: 931 Posts 
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Quote: I already told you the answers to those questions and you keep ignoring them and trying to say that's not an answer when in reality it is. You have a poor defense when you keep saying, "I'm right you're wrong no matter what you say!" You're coming off as immature. You've stated your opinion so why do you feel the need to drag this on and on?
On Sep 22, 2015, LookyLookyMan wrote: I've already stated that the way I perform it is not a prediction and has a logical reasoning behind posting it on social media. This isn't something I'd perform in a professional setting, just a casual impromptu performance. As I've already told you like 3 times, it's synchronicity. Meaningful coincidence. |
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migwar Elite user west yorkshire, UK 457 Posts
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Sigh, We seem to be getting into a discussion about Teleology now, Only in your mind is a pencil and paper the only suitable method of writing down a thought.
Social "media" Media are the collective communication outlets or tools that are used to store and deliver information or data. There are over 41,000 posts a second on Facebook, its a relevant media. I never carry paper and pen , I do carry a "$800" computer around. It makes sense to use this media. For an informal performance this makes sense, Would I do this for a formal performance, nope. Please don't make me explain context to you either. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, TheDirectionalist wrote: You didn't. but never mind. I am guessing English isn't your first language and you simply don't understand. I am trying to work out if you can justify WHY you posted a prediction on a social media site. What about your power means that is the way you have to do the reveal. But really, you seem to be getting awfully upset about it all, so just don't worry. Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, TheDirectionalist wrote: I've never said that, nor anything like that. Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, TheDirectionalist wrote: I'm just trying to work out if there is a plausible reason for justifying using social media and your own computer to do a reveal. Seems there isn't and me asking you about it is really annoying you for some reason. Not to worry. Just ignore me. Maybe someone else has worked out a justification. Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, TheDirectionalist wrote: I don't think you have, but again, not to worry. It's no biggy. Certainly nothing to get as annoyed over as you seemingly are, friend. Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, TheDirectionalist wrote: Yes, that's your performance angle, but it's not a justification for posting your "proof" on the internet. But, again, it really doesn't matter and certainly isn't worth getting annoyed over. Breathe in good, breathe out hate. Boom shanka. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: Never said that. It would lead to a more meaningful conversation about the back story behind the powers we demonstrate if you actually take what I did say and post a counterpoint. Arguing against things I didn't say is a tad silly, isn't it? Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: You're good at using wikipedia, aren't you! Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: Where do I suggest otherwise? Again, try to respond to the things I actually say. Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: Cool. Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: It seems everyone is struggling coming up with the context, or excuse for using a computer and social media and their own phone. I don't blame you for not being able to either. It's a hard problem to solve. Like Derren with the face slapping. Nyman came up with that for him and it is genius. I wonder what plausible reason one could create for needing to predict something on a website, and then having to use your own computer to access that website. And, if you are doing it informally, for friends, your excuse for rapidly deleting that post. And indeed, if they are friends, what you do to make sure they don't read the original time stamped post before you perform. Presentation. It's tricky! |
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migwar Elite user west yorkshire, UK 457 Posts
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A plausible reason?
To people today writing something on social media is absolutely the same as writing it on a bit of paper. Using your own phone makes sense as it's always on you. I wouldn't expect a stranger to let me handle their phone. |
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CJ_Magic205 New user 32 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, LookyLookyMan wrote: I think the draw to Facebook/Twitter/Snapchat is that so many people use it and are familiar with it. I'm in College, and predicting something on Facebook hours earlier is, in my experience, more powerful than a sealed envelope, because, in laymen's (keep in mind, young generation I'm talking about here) minds, Facebook is way more familiar and steadfast than an envelope. I pull out a sealed envelope with a prediction, people automatically think its a tricky envelope magicians use, because they don't see envelopes in that context very often (At least the people I perform for don't). However, they know, in depth, how Facebook works, they use it and see people posting statuses/pictures/etc every single day, so its more familiar to them. In my own experience, I've never had someone say that it was the technology that created the magic. The $800 computer doesn't even come into question, because its such an everyday object (again, I'm at College, so its a special circumstance). Facebook doesn't come into question, either, because its so commonplace. I agree with Lookylookman on almost all your points, I really do, I'm a strong believer in presentation, plot and character far over the effect being presented. However, I've gotten "Can I see the envelope?" far, far more frequently than "you did something on your phone to change the time." I understand I am most likely performing for a very different demographic with a vastly different experience with cellphones, however, that's just my experience, and I've done both. |
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CJ_Magic205 New user 32 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: This is the point I was trying to make. I think both sides have very valid points, and I agree with Lookylookman's points almost entirely, I'm much more of a fan of strong script and character and premise than a mind-blowing effect, especially if that effect has no WHY. In my experience, though, Facebook and cellphones are just as common as pieces of paper (sad, but true in today's world), and I think that's your "why" just as much as a sealed envelope is your "why" |
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CJ_Magic205 New user 32 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, LookyLookyMan wrote: Didn't see this before I posted. I agree, actually. You're right in the sense that it isn't necessarily the most logical to predict something on social media. However, and I really am curious, I'm not trying to start any sort of negative debate, I just really would like to know your opinion, what makes it less plausible or more "odd" to use a phone than a piece of paper? With your friends, I see the point you're making there. However, the way I look at it if I'm performing this for someone in the school Caféteria, its much more organic and logical to pull out a phone than a sealed prediction. I'd like to get your thoughts on this, as I'm relatively new to magic and I'm interested in hearing another viewpoint and learning as much as I can. |
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lunatik Inner circle 3225 Posts
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My friends would be asking me non-stop where I got an envelope and why I am using it. They would automatically suspect something was amiss. But my iPhone and Facebook or Twitter? No, it's something that they use every single day. To say that using social media to post a prediction is weird, I don't understand. Using an envelope and a piece of paper for a prediction would be weird to most people I know, it's something grandma would do. They associate paper and envelopes to writing a letter to someone, not for magic or mentalism, it's just not what they are used for on a daily basis for by 99.9% of our human population.
"Don't let your Dreams become Fantasies"
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daniltan Elite user 477 Posts
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On Sep 22, 2015, LookyLookyMan wrote: I'm struggling to understand, really. You kept on asking about Facebook. But, (you posted) you don't have a Facebook account. That's why I post the Twitter thing. I've said my reason, but it seem like you can't accept it. I use Facebook on daily basis. For more than 5 hours a day, everyday. Why not I use Facebook? And I know many people also use Facebook like me (more or less), so I can easily share my view point to them. You don't have (or deleted) your Facebook account. Maybe, that's why it's so hard for you to accept this. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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On Sep 22, 2015, CJ_Magic205 wrote: You need to think about what power you are demonstrating and what gave you that power and how it manifests itself. Something about the power forces you to use facebook. Not a notes app, not an email, but Facebook. Why? If you can justify that, it could be a strong effect, apart from the whole "hang on while I delete this because you are my friend and would see the real time stamp of the message, and indeed possibly have already read the message at the correct time" issue. Add to that the fact that you are using a computer to do the reveal, so people would assume you can manipulate the data. If you take out a school book, write something down, hand it to someone, then do your routine, they will not think you can alter what you wrote down and they have been holding onto. Hope that clarifies my view. It's not right, nor wrong, it's just my opinion. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: It isn't. All your friends see what you write on facebook. No one sees what you wrote on paper. Quote:
On Sep 22, 2015, migwar wrote: Tell that to all the people performing IUnlockYourMind, EarWorm, Inject, etc etc. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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On Sep 23, 2015, daniltan wrote: I really don't know how many other ways I can say the same thing. What is it about your power that forces you to make the prediction on facebook? Rather than the notes app, a piece of paper, the back of your hand, etc etc. |
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migwar Elite user west yorkshire, UK 457 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 23, 2015, LookyLookyMan wrote: Not all my friends see everything I post on Facebook, it's clear you don't understand how it works. As for tricks involving spectators phones I can see the appeal, personally I'm uncomfortable with people handling my phone, So I wouldn't borrow someone elses. In a similar way I'm uncomforable with using spectators rings for ring flights Also in a prediction effect, Why does his power have to dictate which medium it was recorded on, Its a just record of a statement about the future. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 23, 2015, migwar wrote: I understand exactly how it works. There is an algo that decides what to show you based on your interaction. You can also manually impact that algo deliberately. That makes it worse, doesn't it. You'll have no idea before you perform the trick if the person has seen your status update prediction or not, so will either know or not know if you are lying. Quote:
On Sep 23, 2015, migwar wrote: Oh it doesn't HAVE to. Just like you don't need to think about character, backstory, script or blocking. However, if you do, it makes the effect go from meh to miracle. You clearly don't understand how this works 
Quote:
On Sep 23, 2015, migwar wrote: Facebook isn't used for recording (then hastily deleting) statements about the future. This is why it is incongruous. Facebook is used for posting pictures of your food, your baby, your cat or some Minion meme or candy crush sage etc. If it WAS traditionally used for making statements about the future, it wouldn't feel so odd. |
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migwar Elite user west yorkshire, UK 457 Posts
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I have hastily deleted lots of things on Facebook!!
Recent posts on Facebook - "I'm meeting X for lunch tonight" " I'm going to win big at the races tonight" " I think Bears will whip Patriots butts in the game tonight" Facebook is full of predictions Conflating the medium used to character, scrips and blocking makes no sense in this context. Its like saying my character would never use a pencil, he must use rollball. Its invisible compromise. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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On Sep 23, 2015, migwar wrote: Actually, the difference between a character using a pen and pencil is vast. The devil is in the details. You'd be amazed what people pick up without even realising it and how that helps frame your character as a whole. |
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barts185 Inner circle Can you believe I've been wrong on 1355 Posts
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On Sep 23, 2015, LookyLookyMan wrote: You say you understand exactly how it works and then over the next four sentences prove that you don't know how it works. |
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LookyLookyMan New user 64 Posts
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On Sep 23, 2015, barts185 wrote: That would be a very interesting point if it was true. But sadly, it isn't. I explained exactly how it works. Read up on it, http://kitemedia.co/what-determines-whic......imeline/ You're welcome. |
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barts185 Inner circle Can you believe I've been wrong on 1355 Posts
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Quote:
On Sep 24, 2015, LookyLookyMan wrote: First - nothing has changed on Facebook since 2012, right?  
Second, even if my timeline worked that way (for which you provide absolutely no proof, just speculation and a link to another article that offers more speculation), now explain how any of that would allow someone to see something which I (or my accomplice) write on my timeline while I am performing this in real-time and it's not on my timeline for them to see prior to the start of the effect. Or admit that you are wrong (not holding my breath). |
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Posted: Sep 22, 2015 02:06 pm 
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