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afinemesh Inner circle Senseless gibberish that amounts to 2621 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 25, 2015, Winks wrote: I'm too nice a guy to say (here) what I find clear and obvious about your text.
"I've always been mental, I'm sure of it" Boris Pocus
"Someday we'll look back on this and it will all seem funny". . .Bruce Springsteen |
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reese Inner circle of Hell 1332 Posts |
What is the law? Not to run on all fours. That is the law! Are we not men?
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afinemesh Inner circle Senseless gibberish that amounts to 2621 Posts |
"No, we are DEVO"
Sorry, reese, I couldn't resist!
"I've always been mental, I'm sure of it" Boris Pocus
"Someday we'll look back on this and it will all seem funny". . .Bruce Springsteen |
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RCP Inner circle Two Minnie's in The Hell's Half Acre, The Republic of Texas 2183 Posts |
It's not really that hard. Did someone steal someone else's work? Yes or no? Not hard, name names of go home and lick your wounds in defeat........This PC crap drives me crazy.... if someone stole from you we will punish them for their crime. Present the evidence and let the perp tell their story and then WE can decide and support or punish... easy
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Darkness Inner circle 1626 Posts |
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On Sep 25, 2015, afinemesh wrote: As I stated earlier, interesting use of bandwidth. When you keep saying it that way Jorey, it can easily mean this topic is not worth the bandwidth. Depending on intent and/or tone which is carefully not implied. Since you refuse to qualify, we each try to give it meaning. I have to believe you are not being literal. Yes, some will always cause division and offense. I think we all know who those people are and they are the real interesting bandwidth users. See how I used that in a sentence with context, while being somewhat obscure. At least you know what it means and if you don't, read the next post Chris has said his peace, you have all had your say and made some very good points. Lots of love in the room and he is appreciative. However, unless you know the details, you shouldn't play judge and jury, because it may not be a fitting sentence. Believe in Chris, he is handling it very professionally and it's been addressed.
THE SUPERNATURAL ILLUSIONIST & EFFECTS CREATOR WWW.MRDARKNESS.COM
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reese Inner circle of Hell 1332 Posts |
This is the next post: All of these different viewpoints make sense and as much as I want to know the name, if the offended party doesn't want to let it out then I guess it's none of my business. I'm left to make a guess I guess.
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Eddie Garland Inner circle Hells Kitchen, New York City 4207 Posts |
The Truth may be out there...but it escapes me.
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Pasteboard Alchemist Special user 502 Posts |
Didn't take a ton of hunting to track this down:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/62204723@N......ostream/ |
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reese Inner circle of Hell 1332 Posts |
I've never been a fan of the villagers carrying torches hunting down the monster in the Frankenstein movies. I don't run with that crowd.
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Slim King Eternal Order Orlando 18012 Posts |
Lucky Number 13?
https://www.flickr.com/photos/62204723@N......ostream/ Is this the problem? I'll ask Paul about this right away. He's here in Orlando this weekend.
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
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Christopher Gould Inner circle in special pants. 1029 Posts |
This is a thread that I had no intention of posting on again and I make this post with heavy heart and extreme reluctance.
The last thing that I wanted was a witch hunt or of bringing the sacrificial lamb to the altar. This was an ugly situation that is now made uglier. Did Cody do wrong to make counterfeit copies of my work? Of course he did - and it was a very stupid thing to do, as I could well have sued for copyright theft and for a substantial amount. So why didn't I? Because I think that this is primarily a thing between him and I, not something that is to be aired on a public forum. Yes, I need to protect my intellectual property and more importantly protect those who have bought a legitimate piece that they understood to be a limited edition. Having a public witch hunt is the worse way of achieving any of these aims. Cody contacted me and displayed genuine regret, I asked him some questions and got the answers I required. Three sets were made and give as 'back up copies' to people who already own the original Elite sets - this is what Cody told me. Was this right for him to make these 'back up copies'? Of course it is not. And if everyone wants to leave this with their hands clean, there should be evidence that these sets are destroyed, as has been suggested. What of the people who illegally own these sets, what is there level of culpability in taking a set that they knew to be counterfeit? So, yes, I did what was best to protect my work and the investment of my valued customers. I did it the *right* way, with dignity and in private. I contacted Cody and let him know my feelings in no uncertain terms. I also assured him that I was taking no part in any witch hunt. I am a man of my word, so you can imagine my feeling seeing this whole sorry mess untangle. Seeing my work counterfeited was bad, believe me - not hard for me personally, but my thoughts were with my customers, with other creatives and by extension, the whole community who I see as my friends. But seeing what ensued has been far harder for me to handle. This community is something that I value greatly, it is my life. I have many fine friends here, and my true friends have spoken up in my defence and said all I would have wanted to. I *did* all I needed to do to settle this matter and put a cap on it in regards to the most important thing - customers who legitimately own the Cuss Cards Elite. Yes, for those who own those sets, the three sets out there should be destroyed and evidence shown of this. Then the matter is finished and we should all move on with dignity. How sad is it that a legitimate post on any of my work receives a handful of genuine views, and yet this post receive over a thousand? How does this reflect on our community? I am sorry that this post is repetitive and badly written, but my head is not in a good place this morning. There are two injured parties here. People who own the sets legitimately, and myself as the creator. If you want to know how the latter injured party feels I will tell you - sickened and on the verge of giving all this up.
The Moon is now to be found in the constellation of Gemini:
https://www.geminiartifacts.com |
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Dr Spektor Eternal Order Carcanis 10781 Posts |
By the way - since this thread has revealed angry villager torch types - which is the antithesis of spookies
I am not one of the people who got a back up. I state this because I am an elite owner and the over righteous know it alls likely now want to hunt the 2 people who are complicit down perhaps. Cs and cg know likely who those two are. Maybe they will come forward and clear the air or at least come clean with cg. But really - I finally see why threads get deleted. This was being handled without others needing to run to the rescue with public posts. If anyone here is that pure and above all mistakes - ok fine. I know I've made ones I've regretted myself. I do not condone wrong doing but I do support working through things. There are others in this community who have done way worse that we all know about and yet people get bullied into silence. I am sad to see people going beyond letting Chris try to handle things with much support via non public posts Wow. Spooky has always been sliding to penny forum mentality but this seems another step into devolvement Kudos to Chris for being a gentleman
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
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PROF BC Inner circle 1445 Posts |
I agree that Spooky should remain above the snapping that happens on other fora, yet I (in what I considered a hyperbolic moment) called for mobbing together, torches burning. Mea culpa. For my part (and I suspect this applies to most if not all others) the attempt was to show enthusiastic support for Chris in a time of genuine need rather than any real desire for bloodthirsty revenge.
After my post, I was alerted to the fact that I, too, was a victim of a forged copy from the same source: https://www.flickr.com/photos/62204723@N......ostream/ My response was to shrug it off. I don't know if he made this for himself alone (which is still stealing) or someone 'commissioned' it, but the fact remains, as I said earlier, that the community should respect the work of its inventors, artists, and creators. As to outing, witch-hunts, and shunning, I am with Chris. As I said before, the best remedy against forgery is not to engage in the activity oneself and not to support the activity by buying (or commissioning) forgeries from others. Let's take a deep breath and gain some perspective. Cody did some not very nice things. Chris is satisfied with his resolutions, and I am not looking for any. Case closed. Let's not let this unpleasantness poison our friendly watering hole. We are a charming bunch of macabrephiles, and I anticipate many happy discussions on pleasanter topics ahead. BC
Phasmologist
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Dr Spektor Eternal Order Carcanis 10781 Posts |
Hey, I also was there with a small lighter... I'm as human (or inhuman) as you all - I just quickly remembered there is always more than a single post on a public forum for a story to be truly understood... and backed down - others just kept amping up. I believe this thread maybe should stay if it results in some demonstration of mature resolutions and conduct for we spookies.
The trouble with villagers are they are not doing it because it may be the right thing to do - they often do the burning because they have now entered mob mentality pile on attack mode like lemmings. We all have a bit of it wired into us - but we have our cerebrums to help fight such impulses. Except Aby Norm Al's brain I suppose.... (nods to Mel Brooks)
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
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Al Desmond Inner circle Secret Mountain Lair in Conifer, Co 1511 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 26, 2015, Dr Spektor wrote: If you read back on this thread, there is a broad range of suggestions of how to handle this. In the case of Chris, he decided on a more private approach. And some folk on here wanted a public exposure of the person right up to my suggestion that shunning works wonders. "Amping up" suggests that your way is the only correct way or that Chris' way is the way it should have been handled. No, the opinions on this thread, all the opinions are valid. Now everyone who contributed to this thread can consider the options on how to handle this in the future and make a choice. That's sort of a democratic, community approach. Actually I think this thread is a nice warning to anyone who reads it and has considered duplicating a product and circulating it, especially selling it on or through the Café. |
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Dr Spektor Eternal Order Carcanis 10781 Posts |
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On Sep 26, 2015, Al Desmond wrote: Not sure how I ever said my way was the right way. It was my opinion. You were demanding the ONLY effective way is to stand out and out the culprits. Opinions are valid as opinions. It appears your opinion is you have appointed yourself a moral authority and I do not see how when reading over your posts you had any balance in your arguments. However, perhaps this is your posting style as I have noted the way your posts are expressed often evoke within me (i.e. my valid feelings - NOT REALITY - just like an opinion is not TRUTH) of umbrage, righteousness and know more than the rest of us... but I am not going to go into posting all the examples (and you can then say "cuz here are none.") I bring this up as you - upon this thread - were urging highly to out the person. As for "up to your comment on shunning" I had already posted that BEFORE you. If you are just expressing an opinion - why did you post "I GIVE UP" earlier? Give up what? Trying to convince us you are right and we should listen as you would win a debate? There is a reason why I posted the Wicker Man for you. What I find disagreeable are people jumping into a situation without taking the time to understand it and start promoting actions that may be harmful to many. May what you advocate happen be applied to yourself for any errors you may have made you regretted - and may in doing some repair about it - that others come in who just want to share it with the world without getting your side or anyone else. I do agree with you that this thread is useful for the caveats of copying and knock-offing as something to reflect upon. By the way - why do so many people here buy from some dealers who have a record of knock offs, unethical behaviour and such? Why not out them? Note Al - I HAVE after a great deal of time trying to make sure that all other options and variations that I can reasonably do have been pursued. And they have been posted by others besides me. No social pariah occurred there. However, I find many of your posts make you a kindred spirit to Slim. The one thing I appreciate about Slim's posts is we all know this is a game after a while - and he knows it too. He even tells people he winds them up and watches them go - and people fall for it. You seem to do it for other motives that for me I do not find palatable. So with that, I shall cease engaging with you upon the MC - as it appears to me you are the type I do not want to associate with. Perhaps this is mutual and thus let us disengage. In fact, time again to take a break from this place perhaps.
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
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Stoltz Veteran user 400 Posts |
What could I possibly have to say for myself?
Well, regarding the hand linked in that photo, I made that original one (Which is crap) long before I knew who you were Prof. Later however Rick asked me to make Lucy, which I did at his request. There are photos on the Flickr page actually of the reproduction, sitting in the palm of a Hobbs hand for a comparison shot. Based on what he told me, he had permission to have them made because you no longer had time to produce them. I was just getting into the racket and did not know what was going on. So for this, I sincerely apologize. To my recollection only 2 hands got made this way. That number sticks out in my head, because it cost me a few hundred dollars to be able to make molds for the thing in the first place. And is just another instance of why I'm quitting myself. The Elite CC I made (This was years ago mind you) were only intended for two people other than myself. I still have my copy, and can take pictures of the thing to prove it. I also know where the other two sets are, and no one has sold any fakes. No fakes ever will be sold, because I actually perform this piece. It is my personal modified performance copy. It's slightly smaller, I have added an additional 13th curse, (The Waking Nightmare), shimmed my blessing card(s). And I have even set cards on fire for specific effects, since I could replace them. Despite not posting often (Or ever actually) I am still a part of this community and actually use other creators material when performing. The Cussing cards are one of the best pieces of Magick ever made, IMO. I also tend to abuse my ability to make props to my advantage. Since others made modified Kings sets I never thought it would offend this many people. I assumed others followed the instructions on this forum to head to AM to learn how. I wish I had spoken to Chris first, because I think this would have gone differently. There are many reasons I'm moving on. But know this, it does NOT hurt my feelings to see anyone light torches. I am personally amazed at how great you guys are trying to protect Chris from wrong doing. Yes many disagree how it should be done, but no one thinks its fair game to copy others work, or expose it. |
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Al Desmond Inner circle Secret Mountain Lair in Conifer, Co 1511 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 26, 2015, Dr Spektor wrote: Please accept my apology. My intent was not to insult you or anyone on this thread. I was just suggesting that all comments and opinion had some merit. I am nothing like Slim, even if you think that. Slim would never apologize. |
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RCP Inner circle Two Minnie's in The Hell's Half Acre, The Republic of Texas 2183 Posts |
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On Sep 26, 2015, Stoltz wrote: Thank you coming forward and explaining your actions. Everyone seems to forget that the customers are victims of counterfeit copies as well as the artist. What is most disturbing to me is why my posts have been removed and who has that kind of power here? |
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RCP Inner circle Two Minnie's in The Hell's Half Acre, The Republic of Texas 2183 Posts |
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On Sep 26, 2015, Dr Spektor wrote: We have a right to know the facts, so then we can each draw our on conclusions. I don't need someone to alter the facts to protect their friend. I have PM'd 2 of the 4 parties involved and know their story. My advice to the other 2 is come forward and lets here your version. It's going to come out whether you like it or not. For my part I accept how Chris wishes to handle it and I have no ill feeling to Cody. He has been a man about this. I will continue to support him and hope he will change his mind about leaving. The truth always is the easiest and best path. |
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