|
|
NJJ Inner circle 6437 Posts |
Five years I produced a documentary called Three Disk Monte.
Rather than being a magic teaching DVD it was designed to show law enforcement how the game is played around the world and how to shut it down. I included real footage of real con artists that I collected from around the world. Most of my market was police but since I included a magic routine on it, I also sold it to magicians. Previously, only a handful of resources mentioned the disks and then only in passing. It was great fun to see it in the hands of magicians. Then the trouble started... I started to see reviews mentioning the rubber splitting in half and the glue coming apart. This was confusing because the disks are made of neither rubber nor glue. It turns out, someone had pirated my DVD and shipped it with shoe rubber disks! Also, being in Australia, I struggled to ship the DVDs to the US and Europe for a reasonable price. Both customers and I were frustrated when packages went missing and I was forced to resend them at my own cost. Shipping with tracking via FedEx would cost more than the disks! With my travel and family commitments, it often took weeks to get the DVD into the customer's hands. I decided to take the product off the market for magicians and just focus on the law enforcement market. A few other producers saw the hole in the market and created the disks as magic props. Beautiful disks that, while never meant for the street, look great in a magician's act. My disks are the genuine article as used my con artists and not the works of art that have been made for magicians. However, I still get emails and requests for the disks and I wonder whether it is time to bring back the original three disk monte. I offered a few for sale to magicians a couple of months back and they sold out in hours. Is anyone keen? Or is there enough out there already? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdGOkYl2t1g |
Stperformer Loyal user 291 Posts |
Hi Nicholas,
Would it be possible to buy the DVD only????? Cheers |
NJJ Inner circle 6437 Posts |
I don't see why not.
Since so many people seem to have disks but not the detailed instructions, it seems like a good idea. |
mandy New user 29 Posts |
Nicholas there is any possibility you can upload on youtube a new video using your 3 disks, that's will be amazing to follow your routine. The last video of a routine was uploaded like 4 years ago.. Athank you very much
Mandy |
cheesewrestler Inner circle Chicago 1157 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 28, 2015, Nicholas J. Johnson wrote: Make a deal with a US wholesaler (Murphy's Magic(?)) or dealer (Stevens Magic Emporium(?))? Send one disc to copy & they handle order fulfillment from then on? |
Kabbalah Inner circle 1621 Posts |
I think there is a definite market.
I am interested in the real deal street disks, not the pretty, artsy versions so enamored by the magicians.
"Long may magicians fascinate and continue to be fascinated by the mystery potential in a pack of cards."
~Cliff Green "The greatest tricks ever performed are not done at all. The audience simply think they see them." ~ John Northern Hilliard |
Stperformer Loyal user 291 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 30, 2015, Kabbalah wrote: Personally, as a working professional, I really like the "artsy versions so enamored by magicians". This is just my preference and may not be what others perfer. As a paid performer, the whole game/monte is far different than would be done on the street. Also importantly, not only do the disks look great......they technically work great allowing me to do sleights and effects that may be much more difficult or impossible with those used by a street monte gang. But that's just me and perhaps other would want to perform a more 'authentic version'. Someone playing this on the street would want a cheaper/more readily available disk methinks. Just my thoughts. Nelson |
NJJ Inner circle 6437 Posts |
Nelson is right to an extent.
I have dozens of sets of shells, none of which are suitable for the street. The disks I provided are clean and simple but also very strong and well built. I use them professionally. Anything you can do with a pretty disk you can do with these. When looking at a 'pretty' set make sure you get one that is a single piece. Anything with countersunk spots or obvious joins or lines SCREAMS gaff. Audiences shouldn't want to examine your disks! |
shellgame-al Veteran user Arizona, USA 352 Posts |
Quote:
On Sep 30, 2015, Nicholas J. Johnson wrote: Nelson is fully correct if that is how he feels, the only extent to it is your feelings on it and you are comparing your shells sets when he is taking about disk sets.  If you read your post above you are not giving your opinions, you are stating what magicians should do without any real merit to your statements.  Your last reply sounds like you are getting desperate, by making these false statements on other type disk sets that have no actual truth on what you are trying to imply onto others to sell your product. I see nothing wrong in trying to sell your product, but you should be an honest con-man as you claim to be.  I am the one that makes them pretty disks, as you call them.  From magicswindles.com. Every set I have sold to any type customer, magicians or street workers has loved them. Yes, you are right, your disk is a simple single piece disk that has two different type surfaces on a single piece disk.  One side has a  scratch resistant surface and the other side has a smooth surface with a high maintenance white dot.  Having a disk with two different type surfaces on your disk is why it cannot do the same things as the disk with the matching scratch resistant-surface on both sides of the disk that you are trying to compare your disk too. It is a fact that your disks cannot do everything that a disk set with the matching surface can do.  The only reason the original disk did not have both sides with a matching scratch-resistant surface, the material that is used to make the disks only comes with one side having a scratch resistant surface. This you would understand if you actually made them yourself.    To make a disk set with a matching scratch-resistant surface on both sides of the disk, that is a 1/4" thick it takes the extra work of using 1/8" material. Two 1/8" materials are bonded together, with a bonded embedded solid dot insert of their choice that is also scratch resistant. Then they are machined for a perfect round matching set.  Even all the disk edges are sanded and polished where it is even hard to see that they were bonded together. There are no short cuts to doing this.  In the end, the disks are a set that are a solid one piece disk that will last a life time, that comes without any  scratches on both sides of the disk because both sides are protected and they don't get scratches from throwing them on the surface. The solid embedded insert comes without all the maintenance of having to repaint a dot or putting on a new paper dot sticker on them all the time.   This type disk set takes much more time to make.  You have to have the right machinery and knowledge to make them. I don't sub out any of my work like others.  All the disk sets and shell sets are made in house for good quality control.   These type disks are not gaffed in any way and don't appear to be. No one has ever questioned them to be a gaff disk. You are the first to make such a statement. The only thing that SCREAMS out is how well they are made for a professional magician.  These matching scratch-resistant disks were not made this way just to be pretty, like you put it. They were made this way to bring more handling features: like being able to do a false disk turnover and the option of having an unknown second dot disk in play with only one blank disk.  Also you always have a useful way for an out, if they pick the right disk with the dot.  To do a false disk turnover with a single disk, it must have a matching surface on both sides of the disk. This is a HUGE advantage over other type disk sets.  These type disk can bring a whole new Disk Monte Game to the table for the magician.   Here is a good example with Max T.OZ using these type disks professionally. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xhr16jAu......wner  This type routine cannot be done with your type disks.   As for my disks being pretty, this is because they are a high quality made disk, not a simple disk.  This is a true quality build disk set, Not a piece of plastic that is cut into a circle with a white paper dot sticker put on it. That anyone can make, if they want too.  Your type disk has an un-protected disk face  and this one sided scratch resistant material can even have snatches when you get the material in to make them.  This is because only one side of this type material is normally used for display, the scratch resistant side. The other side is normally bonded to another item that doesn't show, like what is being done for a fully scratch resistant disk set. The un-protected face of the disk can even have scratches before you use them and if the smooth un-protected face of the disk doesn't have scratches it's just a matter of time that they will.  This is all based on facts, not opinions.  The matching fully scratch resistant surface on both sides of the disk is an original idea that brings more features. Even the 3 Card Monte does not have these features.  I also make a high-quality single piece disk that are called the Street Disks;  these are just like the disk sets that was used original on the streets without the matching surface but are made of higher quality.  The con-man specifications are not high-quality specifications.  This is because they made them and are normally using simple tools to make their items. They are made the cheapest and simplest way because they might have to get rid of them if the cops come.   The magician does not have to worry about the cops, so in most cases the magician would prefer more for his money. I offer a choice of both types.  I make the original street type and many other types.  The original Street Disk set we offered at a lower price as they are easier to make.  The truth is the higher priced fully matching scratch resistant disk sets outsells the Street Disk sets by 75-1.  This is because this type disk set can go beyond the street con display.  By making both type disks and seeing what the customer actually wants tells me the real truth on which type disks is needed by the magician.  Again facts from giving a choice to know, not by my personal opinions. There is no con, just facts. With large pictures on all the disk sets that can be seen on the site to know exactly what you would be getting.   I have shipped many disks sets and shell sets worldwide, including many to Australia and have never had any shipments lost.  Also have not needed to ask if my disks sets were needed, as my customers had been very kind in letting me know that they are needed. .    Thanks to all of you,  Al Â
Manufacture of 3 Shell Game Sets & 3 Disk Monte Sets
3shells.com and magicswindles.com |
NJJ Inner circle 6437 Posts |
This is exactly the kind of crap I'm keen to avoid.
I don't want to get into arguments or petty squabbles. I don't know what Al sells and I'm not interested in whipping out disks and comparing. The sun is shining here and there is far too much interesting stuff to do. Good luck with your endeavours to all! |
shellgame-al Veteran user Arizona, USA 352 Posts |
Nicholas,
I agree, I don't want to get into any petty squabbles. But, I do want the true facts about the disk sets that I make and this is why I stated them. Good luck to you too. Al
Manufacture of 3 Shell Game Sets & 3 Disk Monte Sets
3shells.com and magicswindles.com |
skyfire Regular user 136 Posts |
OK, first my real question to this thread is: Is there, or is there not a DVD or two that is currently available on the handling of the Three Disk Monte?
Now that I asked the question I wanted to ask, you can opt to stop reading my post here, or you can continue just to read my two cents on this thread. OK, basically I like the Basic Raw Disk look because there is a setting for that kind of look and performance. It's a down in the street look that some people expect, especially if you are in that type of place. Also quite frankly there is something about a person that has the talent or ability to make a beautiful performance using just the basic non glitzy tool of the trade, that can really impress me. Whether you are talking Shells, Cups, Disks, etc... With that said, I really believe that there is a setting for a performance using pieces that displays beautiful craftsmanship, and different characteristics for different personalities. For me I have a set or two of Cups and Balls that I use when I want to give a serious performance because of how they feel and fit me. But I also have that addiction where I actually have ten other sets just because how beautiful their craftsmanship is. They are my shelf cups. Same goes for my Shells, I have two or three I prefer because of their basic look and how they feel, but my addiction bought another 20 sets that I use on occasions only. Those are my shelf Shells. So it would be great if Nicholas continued to go in hid direction with his product, and it would be great if Al continued with the product he puts out. I would be a customer to both. If I may add quickly, I have already dealt with Al, and I got to say his customer service and product in my opinion has always been great. That's all... |
skyfire Regular user 136 Posts |
OK, first my real question to this thread is: Is there, or is there not a DVD or two that is currently available on the handling of the Three Disk Monte?
Now that I asked the question I wanted to ask, you can opt to stop reading my post here, or you can continue just to read my two cents on this thread. OK, basically I like the Basic Raw Disk look because there is a setting for that kind of look and performance. It's a down in the street look that some people expect, especially if you are in that type of place. Also quite frankly there is something about a person that has the talent or ability to make a beautiful performance using just the basic non glitzy tool of the trade, that can really impress me. Whether you are talking Shells, Cups, Disks, etc... With that said, I really believe that there is a setting for a performance using pieces that displays beautiful craftsmanship, and different characteristics for different personalities. For me I have a set or two of Cups and Balls that I use when I want to give a serious performance because of how they feel and fit me. But I also have that addiction where I actually have ten other sets just because how beautiful their craftsmanship is. They are my shelf cups. Same goes for my Shells, I have two or three I prefer because of their basic look and how they feel, but my addiction bought another 20 sets that I use on occasions only. Those are my shelf Shells. So it would be great if Nicholas continued to go in hid direction with his product, and it would be great if Al continued with the product he puts out. I would be a customer to both. If I may add quickly, I have already dealt with Al, and I got to say his customer service and product in my opinion has always been great. That's all... |
luvisi Special user 601 Posts |
I stand by my original review.
You should absolutely keep this available to the magic community in perpetuity. You have created the equivalent of Scarne's pamphlet for the disks, and every serious student should be able to get it. Selling it without the disks isn't a problem, just give your preferred dimensions and material and let people have a local plastics shop make their disks. Years ago I had TAP Plastics make me a set out of ABS plastic and as I recall it ran me less than $20. I'm still using it. I went for 1/4 inch thick and 3.5 inches in diameter to match the size of a playinc card, which I was already used to. They sanded the edges for me at no extra charge once I explained that I am a magician (as Darwin Ortiz says, this seems to excuse all sorts of strange behavior). Andru
Andru Luvisi
http://www.practicenotincluded.com/ |
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » If right you win, if wrong you lose... » » The Original Three Disk Monte (11 Likes) |
[ Top of Page ] |
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.07 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < |