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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Tommy Wonder cup routine (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Pete Biro
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1933 - 2018
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Dan my man... yes at the Teen event at WMS... as mentioned above.

Frankly, I would never want to do that routine. It is HIS. That's why I do my own routine. It is MINE.

I know he teaches and sells it, but again, it isn't something I do... other people's routines.
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Ron Giesecke
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Quote:
On 2004-03-15 15:57, davidmagic wrote:
Has anyone reading this ever tried to make the balls he describes in his book? I did and could not get the ball right. I see no reason a m rope gimmick (or a m earring from wal-mart) wouldn't work with another type of a tassel. Anyway, the real work is the incredible misdirection. I though M. Ammar was incredible with his third ball appearing on top of the cup-but Tommy Wonder's entire routine is a lesson in directing audience attention where you want it.
David Lewis


David,

I have made everything. It's a bit trepidatious, but It can be done. I have performed the routine as a learning excercise, and I also use it for particular groups who have already seen mine, and want me to perform it again. This gives me a point of departure.

I would not recommend merely using the routine solely as it is, as it is so very much Tommy's. I would, however encourage anyone to learn it, as it provides even more lessons in construction.

A year ago, I used this for a group of grade-school girls. It was obvious from their relationship to my performance that they truly appreciated everything they saw (not a standard hallmark of kid shows).

I decided, at the last minute, to switch to Tommy's routine, and I couldn't have made a better decision. The appearance of the first load was hilarious to them (I do not perform it the same way, patter-wise). They spontaneously went ballistic with the ending.

Tommy contends that this routine is not best suited to a chaotic atmosphere, because his loads demand a certain appreciation for nuance.
Dan LeFay
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Holland
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I completely second Pete's and Ron's comments.
The only two factors in my own cups and balls that resemble Tommy's are the fact that I use two cups and a lot of audience involvement.
Learning his routine was as important to me as learning Vernon's.
"Things need not have happened to be true.
Tales and dreams are the shadow-truths,
that will endure when mere facts are dust and ashes,
and forgot."
Neil Gaiman
Ron Giesecke
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Quote:
On 2004-05-15 11:01, Dan LeFay wrote:

Learning his routine was as important to me as learning Vernon's.



I second that one.
Roland B
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At this time I am working very hard on Tommy Wonder's Two Cups Routine. Making the props correcty is very hard in itself, then I have to do it again and again... But I think the hardest thing will be to make this routine mine. I mean, this is a routine made by Tommy Wonder, for himself, with his text and attitude, his style, and everything, I do not want to clone him, that's one of the reasons why after having bought the DVD, I also got the books. I fear it will be a very, very long time before I can do the routine correctly.

This is one of my very favourite routine in magic.
Rolangicien
Ron Giesecke
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Quote:
But I think the hardest thing will be to make this routine mine. I mean, this is a routine made by Tommy Wonder, for himself, with his text and attitude, his style, and everything, I do not want to clone him, that's one of the reasons why after having bought the DVD, I also got the books.
This is one of my very favourite routine in magic.


This shows what I believe to be a maturity on your part(not that I am setting myself up as a judge or anything).

Here's what's cool about the structural integrity of a routine: Take Vernon's. With minor exceptions, Paul Gertner, Lance Burton, Johnny Ace Palmer, and Bob Read have routines that, when stripped down to their bare essntial moves, are very similar to Vernon's. Gertner's steel ball bearings with Paul Fox Cups makes it entirely a different routine. Burton uses coffee mugs, lemons and a mouse. Palmer uses baby chicks. And God help Bob Read--Monty Python skin streched over a Vernon-esque skeleton.

It is definitely worth it to study as many cups and balls routines as possible--if for nothing more than to try to break them down into their respective phases, and understand them in the same way a composer can see a song in the Intro/verse/Chorus/Bridge/Coda structure.

It will help you more than the material sleights involved in any particular routine ever will.
Jonathan Townsend
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Re: "And God help Bob Read--Monty Python skin streched over a Vernon-esque skeleton. "

Such is exactly why I deconstructed the thing and asked the difficult questions. Somewhere between Vernon and Ramsay is a better way.

What are the cups? And what are the balls? And why do we ask them to care?

Somewhere back in antiquity, someone had a good reason for doing the trick. All have are the moves and have lost the premise, motivation and patter... and a vague belief that the trick is 'traditional'.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Terry Holley
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Jonathan:

I'm interested to hear your answers to your "difficult questions." Can you comment more on all this for us?

Terry
Co-author with illusionist Andre' Kole of "Astrology and Psychic Phenomena."
Pete Biro
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My view.

I prefer the Indian Jadoowalla cups... I have a premise, a reason for what I do that transcends the magic trick part. My version is "handed down from generation to generation... and I will show you how it was taught to me by a true Indian Jadoowalla..."

Which is true.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Ron Giesecke
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Now that Johnathan has quoted me, I now realize that I misspelled "stretched." Makes me insane, not being able to edit my own post after thirty minutes. . .
RiffRaff
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Is the Tommy Wonder STAGE version of the cups and balls in print?
Bill Palmer
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Quote:
On 2004-03-21 17:48, Dan LeFay wrote:
Funny , I can say I did learn the routine from his first book Tommy Wonder Entertains.


Actually, it appeared in print in his "first" first book. Well, his lecture notes, which were called Jos Bema - Lecture. There is a different method for making the big pom-pon come off the string. He does not detail the construction of the balls, but the main elements of the routine are here.

If you wonder how much of an effect this has on laymen, think of this. I didn't get to go to his lecture when he came through Houston. I was working as a musician, and I couldn't get off for the lecture. However, my wife, who is not a magician, went and picked up the notes for me. She told me how amazing and wonderful the cups and balls routine was.

And she tires of classics that are not performed well.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Pete Biro
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Bill you have the routines mixed up. The bloke above was asking about the STAGE version, which I do not think is in print.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Bill Palmer
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No. I was replying to Dan LeFay's post, not the one about the stage cups and balls. That's why I quoted part of Dan's original post.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
pepka
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With Tommy's passing, do you guys think anything else of his will be published? In a way, there's something very cool about taking secrets with you. Not everything was available for sale.

On a side note, I recently found out that a member here bought one of my favorite of Tommy's effects from him right before he passed away. The ultimate watch in nest of boxes. Here's the really funny part. The guy lives less than 2 hours from me. You can rest assured that I invited myself over. I have a friend that would like to tackle that project and we're bothing dying to see a working model.
Bill Palmer
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One never knows what will be published posthumously. All of Hofzinser's props were supposed to have been destroyed upon his death. They weren't. What has survived, technique-wise, may or may not be exactly the way he actually did it.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Pete Biro
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Pepka.... you look "green with envy" Smile
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
pepka
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If someone who lived so close to you had such a treasure, wouldn't you be?
bill7
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ANYbody out there know somone who can put the balls together? I cant find anyone?
suggestions ?
Thanks fellas
Michael Baker
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Quote:
On 2006-08-18 19:41, bill7 wrote:
ANYbody out there know somone who can put the balls together? I cant find anyone?
suggestions ?
Thanks fellas


The Books of Wonder and his earlier book shows how to do it. It is not hard, but it is very time-consuming. They will probably cost you dearly to have someone make them.

~michael
~michael baker
The Magic Company
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