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wizardpa Inner circle The New Orleans area 1011 Posts |
I will probably ruffle some feathers with this post, but I have felt this way ever since I got back into magic back in the 1980's.
A magic trick is described as being almost unbelievable. There might even be an elaborate video of the trick or illusion being performed. You go ahead and buy it. Then when you get it, you discover all of the flaws. It really is not exactly how it was described or shown on the video. There is something not as described. I feel like I just bought an used car that I was told to be owned by some old lady who only used it on weekends, but I find out that the car is really a step away from the junk yard: I could offer a lot of real life examples, but I'm sure that everyone that reads this knows what I mean. Thank goodness, I'm handy and creative enough to fix the things that are wrong with the trick or illusion. I recently spent over $1,000 on an illusion that I could no longer buy an essential thing that I would need to do the illusion. The seller had to know this. I even consulted experts who could offer no solution. Lucky for me (I) came up with a solution that worked. The magic dealer I bought this used item from did not care. I was almost out of $1,200. |
Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
I am sorry of missing your point. You seem to be taking the position it is wrong to lie and cheat. OK I agree.
The only thing I take issue with is you saying what the seller "had to know", and claiming they didn't care. To be fair you might be right but it calls for you to know the operation of another's mind and you can not do that.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
wizardpa Inner circle The New Orleans area 1011 Posts |
Yea I guess you might be right.
Now I would like to ask you an ethical question? Suppose they did not know that they were selling an illusion that one could no longer get one of the most important parts, and they they were told out about it. Do you think that they should have taken the illusion back and refunded the money? I do and then then they could try to figure out a solution before selling it again. I'm sorry to say this, but I believe there are a lot of people selling things that they know are not as described or as a video shows. That's my point! |
Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
You sell me a car you have no idea will break down horribly in 13 miles. Are you required to buy it back? It comes to knowledge, but it is also on you, Do you feel you have any responsibility in the purchase of a used item? Is it not your job to o your research to see if you can or can not get the parts neeeded?
I don't thik it crosses a line if you don't take the time to do some research on a $1,200 purchase. Why would you not check it out prior to that? It is called due dilligence. It is not the job of the seller to educate you, and if they do not outright lie to you or misrepresent the facts then there is no ethical issue. It is a lazy issue. Sorry to say. Now people who sell things that are not properly represented in video are outright telling lies. That is another story and that is not ethical. But even if this guy KNEW HE could not get parts, it in no way means YOU can't get parts or just find a work around. Classic cars often change hands because one guy runs out of time, has no more money, or just not enough ability to fix the project. Another guy comes along with enough of everything to do what is necessary to fix it. Should the first guy get his money back because it was more work than he thought? Not every sale that a person has buyers remorse over is the fault of the seller. Outright deception is one thing. Lies about "oh it works perfect" or "It will do X" and it obviously does not do X are one thing. You not being able to find parts, even if he KNEW seems to me to be more on you not doing the proper research prior to spending $1,200.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
wizardpa Inner circle The New Orleans area 1011 Posts |
I probably should not have blamed the dealer that sold the $1200 illusion because I really do not know he knew. At least I hope not. I do not want to be more SPECIFIC because, I do not want to expose anyone. If I had tried to research what is an old illusion, it would have guided me to the wrong part anyway. There is a lot more to what happened in this purchase then what I want to say.
Let me ask you a simple question? If I did not find a solution, but I knew it could not work as is. Would it be right for me to sell it and act like I had no idea it could not work, and when informed that it could not work, say, I'm sorry but you can not return it? My real point of this post is that there is a lot of deception going on. You can not tell me someone with your experience has not bought something that was not what it was supposed to be. I honestly have never sold anything, magic or otherwise that did not work as described. |
Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Again if you are asking if it is ok to lie I think the answer is obviously no.
You are telling part of a story and that may be the reason for my confusion. If you KNOW he lied then it is wrong. The question is HOW exactly you know this or if you are making assumptions? Many times things are not what they appear. But if he blatantly lied or misrepresented then that is certainly wrong. Without knowing more it is impossible to say otherwise.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
writeall Special user Midland, Michigan 930 Posts |
That is a tough one. Tougher when the price is so high.
We see it all the time in the lower price ranges. As soon as something appears in a "Latest and Greatest" thread, the same types of questions pop up repeatedly: "Will this work with polymer bills?" "Can I buy that type of waterbottle/pen/candy/anything-else-essential in my part of the world?" "Are refills available?"... on and on. Caveat Emptor I guess. Glad you found a workaround and curious to know what the missing ingredient was. |
wizardpa Inner circle The New Orleans area 1011 Posts |
It is not fair for me to accuse the seller that they knew about one of the most important things of this trick, but everyone knows that because of the world wide web, we can find anything. Guess what? As far as I know, after searching for hours, I could not find what I needed. Even searching the last company that sold this, was in Germany, in 2009.
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