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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » How to justify a higher fee? Advice needed (9 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Memory-Jah
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Mülheim an der Ruhr / Germany
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Hi folks. I need some advice from you. I am sure this is the right place to ask.

I am currently being asked for a gig in October by a very big company.They hired me last year and asked me for this year again.
Now here comes the problem: Last year I did this for very little. Much has changed during the last year, more and better paid gigs came in, and when they asked me and I told them my current price their first reaction (2 min later via email) was: Oha, that's 100% more than last year". Now how do I react to this? What is the best and most professional way, WITHOUT scaring them off, to let them know that I am worth more now.

Last year I was very happy to be hired and I did it for way too little. I wanted this client on my reference list and at this point it was quite a bit of money for me.
People (other magicians, even spectators and people who hired me) keep telling me I am too cheap. However the company who wants to hire me now faces almost twice my old price. How can I justify that in a polite and still hooking way?

My two thoughts about it are: My whole worth as such (performance, material, clothing etc) rose in worth. So I had to adjust the price to my worth.
My second point is that I am way more often hired than before and people paying higher fees.
Please share some experience. I don't want to lose the job, but I also do not wish to sell myself under my worth and setting a false value for future gigs.


Looking forward to reading your thoughts.

Markus
"Dropping your pants while you set off flash paper may allow your pass to go undetected, but it's still not invisible." - Count Elmsley
Dannydoyle
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So not justify anything. It weakens your position. Either they pay it or they don't but why justify it? As you raise process you lose clients. It is natural.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
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This is the problem with raising prices. You will hear so many performers boast about raising their prices due to this or that, but in reality, unless it is a minor increase which a client can deem acceptable, you can likely lose the client when attempting to raise your prices too soon or too much.

It's one thing if they had you three or four years ago, then a reasonable price increase can (to them) perhaps be justified. Unless you can show or prove to them the justification for the increase you will likely jeopardize the booking and also the lifetime value of that customer.

It is not easy to raise prices. Even if you were on American Idol or AGT, as many people think, it simply doesn't happen that easily. There can be ways and opportunities from these, but this is not one of them. This is not about you and your perception, it is about them. When you set your price last time, what you essentially did was create and set your value in their mind that price is what you were worth to them. If you did a good show and they were pleased, you were deemed worth that price/value, which is why they contacted you again this year. To change that changes their entire perception, expectations and your value to them. Big mistake.

This is one of the worst problems is when entertainers cut their price in order just to get a gig or client. They will always be seen as only worth that price or value to them, with only a few very rare exceptions.

Everything you described above are your thoughts from your perspectives. That is not how a client works or what they care about. This is really quite simple. If you doubled your price to them since last time or even raised it more than 10-20%, you have a decision to make. Either accept this at last years price or greatly risk losing the client. You could try for a slight increase but you better justify it better to them that "My whole worth as such (performance, material, clothing etc) rose in worth." That's a you problem and perception (and likely not the reality at all, very few performers double their value in 12 months), not a them problem or concern. Other performers have the same and the entire industry hasn't raised their prices the same as you.

This is exactly why it hurts the entire industry and your local market when performers under-price themselves just to get a booking. It sends the message that this is the value for that type of service. It is a very self-serving approach. It can also work against you in more ways than benefit.

Performers have to quit looking at bookings as "one and done" gigs or income, instead they need to be establishing relationships that can make that client worth thousands of dollars to them over many years, even if you screwed up by quoting to low. That was a you error (and hopefully a learning lesson) that if anyone should pay for its you. You can't expect them to pay for your error or learning curve.

This all happened because you didn't properly address and decide on the right and necessary foundational decisions required as a performer or entertainment business BEFORE going to market. The corners one cuts ALWAYS comes back to catch up to them or haunt them eventually. Lesson learned, hopefully.

Also remember, if you don't accept it, their most certainly will be others that will, just like you did. You established your value too low. You now realize that, but you have to live with that. If you attempt to change or correct it, you must accept the risk in trying to do so.
Karen Climer
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Quote:
On Jul 18, 2016, Mindpro wrote:
This is exactly why it hurts the entire industry and your local market when performers under-price themselves just to get a booking. It sends the message that this is the value for that type of service. It is a very self-serving approach. It can also work against you in more ways than benefit.


Seriously? It is self-serving to charge a low price? If that is self-serving, then is charging a high price considered altruistic? I would say it is self-serving to expect others to charge what you decide is appropriate, so that you can charge what you want.

If you (generic you, not you personally Mindpro) can't justify your price by your performance, you probably are charging too much. In other words, if the guy charging $100 for a show is hurting your ability to get $1000 for a show, then your show isn't worth $1000. If the consumer thinks you can be replaced by the $100 guy, that's the problem. The problem isn't that the $100 guy is charging too little. The problem is that you have done nothing to make your product better than his.

I get so tired of performers say that low-priced performers are hurting the entire industry. You can buy a $20 watch at Wal-mart. That has exactly zero effect on the sale of $2,000 watches or $20,000 watches. There is a market for all of them. Likewise, there is a market for all levels of magicians. If the cheapest magician in town charged $500 for a birthday party, that would not mean that everyone would pay $500 for their birthday party. It would mean that fewer people would have magicians at their birthday parties. Is there a market for $500 magicians? Yes. There is also a market for $100 and $300 ones too. (I'm using birthday parties as an example, but the same principle applies to any type of magician.) Now, do I want to be the $100 magician? No. But if someone can't tell that the difference between me and the $100 guy, then the problem is me, not the price point of the $100 guy.
Tim Friday
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Memory-Jah, thanks for sharing. It comes across to me that some of the responses here have not been directly constructive for your concern, but rather chiding. This is a shame because I believe your hope is to come up with a constructive solution, not to be shamed when you took the courage to make yourself vulnerable by asking a question.

I would like to share two ideas about how to communicate with your client:
1) come from a place of gratitude, let your client know how much you appreciate them coming back to you again
2) come from a place of expressing how excited you are about the opportunity of working with them again

I believe if you communicate these two things it will come from a much better place than the stance of "I am worth more now."

Expressing gratitude and excitement about the opportunity communicate to your client that you are concerned about their best interests, whereas "I'm worth more value now" is all about you.

You can certainly still communicate to your client how your business has grown and your rate has increased, but I believe it will go over much better if you communicate the other two things.

I have more I could share with you that could specifically help you get a higher rate, but I can't post it here publicly because they are not my ideas, but if you send me a PM I will be glad to share more.
Karen Climer
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Now, to answer the question... I like Danny's idea of not justifying it. If you feel like you have to justify it, just say this:
Client: That is 100% more than what I paid last year.
You: Yes, I increased my prices.
That feels like a justification when you say it (and may even seem like one to them), but really it isn't. You are just stating the facts.

If they ask you why the price increase is so much (not likely), you could say that you have become more popular and are being booked so much that you needed to raise your prices.

For me personally, once I name the price for the event, that's the price. I won't lower the price just because you asked me to. However, I will lower the price for a lesser product. For example, if I quote a price for a 45-minute show. The client can't do that. Well, I can come to your event for less, but it will be a 30-minute show.

BTW, I think finding the optimal price point where you are getting the maximum you can without pricing yourself out of the client's range is one of the most difficult parts of business. There isn't really a good formula for it. The formula I suggest to people is if you want more gigs, lower your price. If you want fewer gigs, raise your price.

Good luck with it.
thomasR
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To the OP...

If this is a good gig, and they want you back... I would do everything to keep that gig. Perhaps you could offer them a discount off your current "Full Rate" since they are a repeat customer?
This discount could still be more than you charged last year.. but not such a drastic leap.
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On Jul 18, 2016, Tim Friday wrote:
Memory-Jah, thanks for sharing. It comes across to me that some of the responses here have not been directly constructive for your concern, but rather chiding. This is a shame because I believe your hope is to come up with a constructive solution, not to be shamed when you took the courage to make yourself vulnerable by asking a question.

I would like to share two ideas about how to communicate with your client:
1) come from a place of gratitude, let your client know how much you appreciate them coming back to you again
2) come from a place of expressing how excited you are about the opportunity of working with them again

I believe if you communicate these two things it will come from a much better place than the stance of "I am worth more now."

Expressing gratitude and excitement about the opportunity communicate to your client that you are concerned about their best interests, whereas "I'm worth more value now" is all about you.

You can certainly still communicate to your client how your business has grown and your rate has increased, but I believe it will go over much better if you communicate the other two things.

I have more I could share with you that could specifically help you get a higher rate, but I can't post it here publicly because they are not my ideas, but if you send me a PM I will be glad to share more.


OK first off I am getting a little tired of your holier than thou attitude. I absolutely did NOT chide him at all. You need some reading comprehension classes. NOBODY shamed him at all.

As for your last sentence how is it better to share information that is not yours one on one as opposed to in public? How is it less wrong to do it like that?

Here is the problem you will end up with "justifying" your price. IT CAN'T BE DONE. You are worth more, because you can charge others more and get it. PERIOD. How can you justify anything? ANYTHING you say in trying to justify your price simply puts you in a weaker position. Tim as such an amazing sales guy it seems odd you don't get this part.

Before you get to your price, ALL justification should be done. It is long since past time to justify your price. You are closing the sale by the time they are asking you for your price. Old customers are a bit different as there is an expectation. They have a frame of reference. Funny part is that to these people there is NO justification that will work. They hired you and were happy and want you to return. BUT since you have more experience, a better client base and are in higher demand you are "worth" more. Problem is to THAT client it is entirely possible that you are not "worth more". You were (To them.) worth what they paid and maybe a little more. Not 100% more.

You will raise your prices, and you will lose clients for this. Some of the clients you had at that price range may very well have been stretching a budget to hire you. They can not afford (Or do not see the value.) in paying 100% more than your earlier price. This is not a bad thing. If you want to grow, you will lose clients. Getting clients who paid X to pay XX is not really possible on every level. It may happen with some, but not the vast majority. AND THIS IS A GOOD THING! You want this to happen.

It is a sign of a healthy business in which it seems as if you are doing lots of right things. Be happy about it. And congratulations.

Karen, yea definitely.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Ray Pierce
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If you have increased your value and are actually worth more (and are consistently getting the increased rates as you mentioned) then stick with the price and risk possibly losing one client. If you're just raising the price because it's a really big company and you think they must have more to spend, that's a different issue. The reality is that they probably came back to you because they thought they got a good deal for the price so they had those expectations. You could loose one client but evidently the others are happy. You will have more provable value when you get asked back consistently by the current clients at the higher price point.

I'm sure the first price point was a little low but even then, that growth in one year is pretty amazing!
Ray Pierce
<BR>www.HollywoodAerialArts.com
TomBoleware
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Quote:
On Jul 18, 2016, thomasR wrote:
To the OP...

If this is a good gig, and they want you back... I would do everything to keep that gig. Perhaps you could offer them a discount off your current "Full Rate" since they are a repeat customer?
This discount could still be more than you charged last year. but not such a drastic leap.


I agree with thomasR; they helped you get to where you are so don’t be so unappreciative and think they don’t matter anymore.
'Using' clients to the point of doubling your fee all at once is a bad idea. Explain that your fee has increased, and that
you did under charge the first time, but you will still give them a discount off the new rate.

Tom
"Entrepreneurs are willing to work 80 hours a week to avoid working 40 hours a week"--Lori Greiner

www.tomboleware.com
charliecheckers
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Quote:
On Jul 18, 2016, Karen Climer wrote:
Seriously? It is self-serving to charge a low price? If that is self-serving, then is charging a high price considered altruistic? I would say it is self-serving to expect others to charge what you decide is appropriate, so that you can charge what you want.

If you (generic you, not you personally Mindpro) can't justify your price by your performance, you probably are charging too much. In other words, if the guy charging $100 for a show is hurting your ability to get $1000 for a show, then your show isn't worth $1000. If the consumer thinks you can be replaced by the $100 guy, that's the problem. The problem isn't that the $100 guy is charging too little. The problem is that you have done nothing to make your product better than his.

I get so tired of performers say that low-priced performers are hurting the entire industry. You can buy a $20 watch at Wal-mart. That has exactly zero effect on the sale of $2,000 watches or $20,000 watches. There is a market for all of them. Likewise, there is a market for all levels of magicians. If the cheapest magician in town charged $500 for a birthday party, that would not mean that everyone would pay $500 for their birthday party. It would mean that fewer people would have magicians at their birthday parties. Is there a market for $500 magicians? Yes. There is also a market for $100 and $300 ones too. (I'm using birthday parties as an example, but the same principle applies to any type of magician.) Now, do I want to be the $100 magician? No. But if someone can't tell that the difference between me and the $100 guy, then the problem is me, not the price point of the $100 guy.


I believe what Mindpro was referring to is those who offer pricing to clients without knowing and understanding the market, and in reality are not beneficial to the proper development of their own business. Of course we are all free to do as we choose in a free marketplace, but many offer pricing that leaves them disappointed and not long for sustainable business.

In the example you offered with watches, each of those companies understands the market and their business model. Entrance into those retail markets in and of itself offers a barrier few can overcome, so those that do enter those markets generally are knowledgeable and experienced. In lower end entertainment venues, the barrier to entry is relatively low (and becoming far more widely accessible due to lower cost marketing costs). In this situation, you have those of us who are newer and less experienced not understanding the market or even what pricing is in our own best interests entering the market and skewing the market perception to uneducated buyers. Not only are we potentially creating a pricing structure for ourselves that we may well later regret, we are creating false expectations on what it costs to bring the entertainment level they are truly seeking. I can speak from personal experience that I came with very little knowledge or acknowledgement of this, but try to work towards efforts that drive my interests, as well as fellow entertainers by simply being aware. This is one topic where my participation on TMC Tricky Business has really opened my eyes.
misterillusion
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What I do is add value to to my performance--like a stage illusion. When having the discussion with the client I show and tell them about a new finale I have added (chair suspension, or victory cube, or asrah for example). I tell them and show them the effect then sell them on adding this to the program for a substantial up-charge. You have to have the props, of course, to do this. This works for me frequently.
May every day be magic!

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Mindpro
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Quote:
On Jul 20, 2016, charliecheckers wrote:

I believe what Mindpro was referring to is those who offer pricing to clients without knowing and understanding the market, and in reality are not beneficial to the proper development of their own business. Of course we are all free to do as we choose in a free marketplace, but many offer pricing that leaves them disappointed and not long for sustainable business.

In this situation, you have those of us who are newer and less experienced not understanding the market or even what pricing is in our own best interests entering the market and skewing the market perception to uneducated buyers. Not only are we potentially creating a pricing structure for ourselves that we may well later regret, we are creating false expectations on what it costs to bring the entertainment level they are truly seeking. I can speak from personal experience that I came with very little knowledge or acknowledgement of this, but try to work towards efforts that drive my interests, as well as fellow entertainers by simply being aware. This is one topic where my participation on TMC Tricky Business has really opened my eyes.


Yes, this was one of the exact points. There are reasons things should often be done in a sequential order. When the proper foundational determinations, decisions and research or due diligence is not properly done you will make a foundation that will have problems, cracks and deficiencies that at some point with create problems, setbacks or possibly even crumble later on. Most performers are just so anxious to get a paid booking they pass over many of the important aspects, or worse yet don't know about them, are completely unaware and try to proceed without education, knowledge or assistance. This is why you have guys that have been doing this for 20 years and are no farther along or successful today than they were two or three years out of the gate.

As far as Karen's thoughts...

"Seriously? It is self-serving to charge a low price? If that is self-serving, then is charging a high price considered altruistic? I would say it is self-serving to expect others to charge what you decide is appropriate, so that you can charge what you want.

I get so tired of performers say that low-priced performers are hurting the entire industry. You can buy a $20 watch at Wal-mart. That has exactly zero effect on the sale of $2,000 watches or $20,000 watches. There is a market for all of them. Likewise, there is a market for all levels of magicians. If the cheapest magician in town charged $500 for a birthday party, that would not mean that everyone would pay $500 for their birthday party. It would mean that fewer people would have magicians at their birthday parties. Is there a market for $500 magicians? Yes. There is also a market for $100 and $300 ones too. (I'm using birthday parties as an example, but the same principle applies to any type of magician.) Now, do I want to be the $100 magician? No. But if someone can't tell that the difference between me and the $100 guy, then the problem is me, not the price point of the $100 guy."

It's not what "I" think is appropriate it what the market thinks is appropriate and your value within the market. Yes, they are two different things but often one affects another. I agree there is a place for all magicians at all prices, but on purpose not just in the name of low-balling and bringing down the market. It is actually quite easy to determine pricing within the market. Again, do some research, find out what others in the market charge from the low-end performers to the premium guys or girls, and then intentionally and deliberately decide where you want to be in that structure and WHY. As you said, understanding there is room for all, where do you strive to be and what makes you able to execute at that position? What will create your value at that position? If you're going for the higher or premium end of the market, it must be more than just a decision, you should have the value, offering and knowledge to operate and execute at that level. As I've always said complete and utter honesty is absolutely required when making these foundation decisions. Putting yourself on a level of which you are not actually will only create a wonky structure and business operation.

As far as the Walmart example you mentioned, consumers (the customers) know that there are high end watches and that the $20 watch is a budget, bargain or lower-end watch. They are educated. They know what Walmart is known for (savings and great pricing) and do not expect to find a Rolex behind the counter. Most purchasers (customers) of entertainment, especially in consumer markets are not educated on entertainers pricing, structures and values. So the only thing they'll go on if there is no referral, is typically defaulting to price. In this scenario the bottom-feeder crates the perceived value and price to them. Unless educated, the market gets brought down.

When people came into our showroom we would immediately tell them there are entertainers in all prices from budget performers to (using magic) David Copperfield. We'd let them know we are definitely not he lowest so if that's what they're looking for we likely can't help them and they'd be better off going somewhere else. If however they wanted top notch, professionals, with.... we have several options for them. They we would proceed to educate them to the market and the differences.

Very few strive to be a bottom-feeder or budget performers. Once labeled that it's hard to change or overcome it.

With the OP this should have been consciously decided before quoting his first booking with this client. I still say it is very difficult to double your pricing in just 10-12 months. Are you worth double the value to the client? Will the audience be doubly pleased and entertained? The answer is no. He set up a situation and can likely risk losing the client if he insists on this. Truth be told, his value likely didn't double in the year. Rather he may have gotten better, wiser, a bit more educated and a bit more experience, but again, that doesn't create increased value or perception to the client. Only to the performer, unless he can definitively show increased value in their eyes.

As far as Tim Friday...

"It comes across to me that some of the responses here have not been directly constructive for your concern, but rather chiding. This is a shame because I believe your hope is to come up with a constructive solution, not to be shamed when you took the courage to make yourself vulnerable by asking a question."

Again with the jabs an digs. Gratitude and expressing how excited you are about the opportunity is neither increasing his value or value to them, or reasons to double your pricing. These things should go without saying for ANY gig. You can communicate these all you want, it doesn't change the reality, it still doesn't increase his value or worth to them, sorry.

Misterillusion, you make a good point in an attempt to show increased value but in your scenario, you are still trying to justify your pricing to them. As Danny pointed out, the ideal situation is where you set and create your own value and others take it or leave it. But in this case, you must be prepared to walk away from those that do not see, appreciate or understand your value.

Performers make a bigger deal our of pricing than necessary. If they look at it systematically based on knowledge and determination of the right elements, it actually becomes quite easy. Also the promotional materials, marketing and positioning also becomes much easier and almost identifies itself (another thing many performers fret over).
charliecheckers
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Perhaps he OP is asking the wrong question. First, it seems as though the initial price quote and performance were carried out without a well developed idea of how to optimize the opportunity to work with a large company. His only thought was to land the gig so he could list them among his clients. Now, he once again seems to be approaching the opportunity with a narrow scope of vision, thinking "how can I get double my previous asking price?" Even if his value is truly worth double last years quote, there are other ways to get full value without getting double the money. In fact, getting double the money would be low on my priorities in such a situation.
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I like Danny's comments and agree with them more than Mindpro's this round.

It is normal and natural when building your business to charge less to get gigs. You received something as a fair trade for those gigs: a gold client and hopefully positive testimonial, experience, and the possibility for future bookings for a job well done. Bravo.

They received a good value for their money spent.

There is never a guarantee that past clients will want to or be able to afford to book you in the future. Prices go up for many reasons. You will lose past clients as your business grows and your prices grow too. It's healthy and as frustrating as it may seem, to me it would be worse for tge OP to quote a higher price this year - and then backtrack if/when the client objects.

Stand your ground and be willing to walk. Other clients will pay your higher prices if this one doesn't want to pay more.
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of premium, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
saysold1
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Quote:
On Jul 22, 2016, charliecheckers wrote:
Perhaps he OP is asking the wrong question. First, it seems as though the initial price quote and performance were carried out without a well developed idea of how to optimize the opportunity to work with a large company. His only thought was to land the gig so he could list them among his clients. Now, he once again seems to be approaching the opportunity with a narrow scope of vision, thinking "how can I get double my previous asking price?" Even if his value is truly worth double last years quote, there are other ways to get full value without getting double the money. In fact, getting double the money would be low on my priorities in such a situation.


I think you are way way overthinking this.

A well developed idea of how to work with a large company? Please.

That all sounds darned impressive but in real life - especially at the very start - performers shoot from the hip and trial by fire and learn as they grow. That's reality.
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of premium, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
Mindpro
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I would like to hear from the OP to see how he chose to handle it and the outcome of this particular situation.
Dannydoyle
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Btett good point about shooting from the hip. So true.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
charliecheckers
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On Jul 25, 2016, saysold1 wrote:
I think you are way way overthinking this.

I have always sought to leverage unique opportunities and consider the longer term impact on my business vs just the one time booking fee. The OP indicated that this was a booking outside of his norm. That is why he was seeking advice. The advice I shared was in an effort to allow the OP to fully consider long term possibilities that could develop with this company vs a short term payoff. That hardly seems to qualify as "way way overthinking this" in my way of thinking.

Quote:
A well developed idea of how to work with a large company? Please.

Really?

Quote:
That all sounds darned impressive but in real life - especially at the very start - performers shoot from the hip and trial by fire and learn as they grow. That's reality.

In real life I have developed relationships with large companies. In one situation, my contact was able to introduce me to a customer of his (another large company)that hired me for multiple shows. In another instance, a large company that I currently perform several shows a year, I am building a long term relationship in hopes to land 40 or more as I transition to full time. I am also thinking longer term with respect to potential sponsorship possibilities. Of course I have shot from the hip. But I also think strategically and try to move forward in a purposeful way. To suggest that considering ways to leverage opportunities with large companies is pie in the sky thinking separate from reality and that one is better off simply doubling their asking price from the year prior, is poor advice in my opinion.
Mindpro
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Quote:
On Jul 25, 2016, saysold1 wrote:
I think you are way way overthinking this.

A well developed idea of how to work with a large company? Please.

That all sounds darned impressive but in real life - especially at the very start - performers shoot from the hip and trial by fire and learn as they grow. That's reality.



Yes and no. Rarely do they "shoot from the hip" in terms of this is it, take it or leave it or this is what I offer and this is my price.

Truth be told in the beginning most newer performers don't have a specific of individual value. The operate on more of a crap shoot than shooting from the hip. Unfortunately most of them ARE just part of the pack - they're still learning the ropes, they're still learning the business, they're still learning their value (if any), which is why they tend to, as Brett said, take whatever jobs they can get.

Now the point is, it doesn't have to be that way if performers approach it from a predetermined business foundation and the approach charlie mentioned. If one actually sits down and strategically starts their business by answering a concise set of determinations and decisions and predetermining/selecting the value they want to have, and of course not going to market until they have created that value, then they can do much more straight shooting from the hip based on this reality.

Most people look at an inquiry like the Op's client the first time, as a booking opportunity and that's it. Very few look down at it frem the perspective of the lifetime value of this customer. I have clients I've doing 28 years, 26 years, many at around 24-25 years. The client I'm working this week is not in my 29th consecutive year. These are every year, sometimes multiple times per year for decades. All of these wee created from this exact strategized approach from the very first day, from their very first contact, not just looking at them as single bookings and simply quoting a price. I challenge anyone (and trust me these have been dozens over they years) to try to take any of these accounts away from me. They can't. Only I can provide the client with what I offer. They can't get it anywhere else. That was by design from my own foundation. At this point, as Danny said, you create and set your own value and there is no justifying involved. Again, most do not approach it this way or are not in a position for this. Look at Anton Z. he worked trade shows for over 30 years and in that time only had 12-14 actual clients. But he approached then this very same way we're discussing which allowed him to have SEVERAL million dollar contracts with these clients. One or two of them actually renewed for a second million dollar plus term/contract. So the point is, as I've said repeatedly, it's all how you start and form your busindss from the foundational level. If you do the typical way most performers do it, from what I call the default approach of "jump in and just start paddlin'" you're going to have these problems. I don't care who you are, you aren't going to double your prices in one year and just expect clients just to roll over and pay for it.

Yes, a well developed plan, especially for corporate and professional markets is not only quite possible, but it actually a much more preferred business model, not to mention almost always more lucrative. For those that do this, this IS their real life.

But also as I've regularly shared, the performer must start from a place of complete and utter honesty of exactly what and where they are. Any imagined or manufactured perceptions will likely make it all crumble and not get out of the gate.

While I'm not sure Brett offered bad advice as much as his own preference and opinion, I do agree that lately there has been quite a bit (more than I can ever remember before) of bad to terrible advice being offered here, much by relative newer performers with only minimal experience in limited markets.
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