|
|
Nathan Alexander![]() Inner circle 2118 Posts ![]() |
There's a fairly successful party rental/jump bouncy house close to me. They are a big facility that obviously has birthday parties for kids, etc. I see a win-win for offering to partner with them, but wouldn't know the best approach, including a payment split.
How would you guys approach it? I wanted to send a package introducing myself and my (20 years) experience that they could offer as an add-on for parties, etc. How do you structure fees so it's a no-brainer for them? What do you guys do? I could offer them all the material for advertising (fliers, b-cards and so on) that they'd need, but just can't figure out what's fair for costs so they would want to promote an in-house magician? Thoughts? |
Dynamike![]() Eternal Order FullTimer 24148 Posts ![]() |
1. Make contact with the individual(s) who set up the events. If you have some kids to bring there, go ahead. Find out who is in charge of the bookings. Approach that person in a nice manner explaining how you like the venue. Explain what you do and how you would be beneficial to him and his guest if you did magic shows there.
2a. Let the individual know their business would get a flat rate fee for each booking they will book you in. 2b. Have the business pay you a fee for each gig they can book you in. 2c. Give the business a fee for giving your name out to each customer you get for an approved show. 3. Get liability insurance. 4. If you do not feel comfortable presenting a stand up act, do strolling magic for the business each week. There are all kinds of things you can do. You must decide what is best for you. |
Mindpro![]() Eternal Order 10696 Posts ![]() |
Nathan, tell me how you see the win-win?
|
Nathan Alexander![]() Inner circle 2118 Posts ![]() |
Thanks Dynamike, I appreciate it.
Sure Mindpro, although my perspective is limited, so I may not know anything. They're primarily a private-rental facility as I understand it. They make their money from mostly kid parties of one kind or another (we've been there for 2 bday parties). Assuming it's true (I suppose I'd have to know), they get to have another service available as an option add-on. By itself, I would think (I don't know for sure!) they might like having that on their menu of options as it looks good to be even more of a complete "one-stop" kids party-central (as they tend to advertise that way). And as far as that goes, it's kind of akin to grab bags that some magicians offer. With multiple packages, some parents aren't even aware of that option and take them up on it as it's a nice add-on (a magician does that very well near me, but I do more libraries and school shows, hmm...) and they appreciate knowing they could add it. But even if it's a small percentage that take them up on a show (during or after their 2-hour rental) the win is obvious for me as it could be a booked show I wouldn't have necessarily gotten otherwise, with little to no work (same for cost) on my part. So for them? I guess I just see it as a win where people may appreciate the option and of course, they can make money with little to no work on their part and maybe even be a hero to a few families (out of many) that want to add that in. Maybe I'm off? The idea has been bugging me to figure it out. ![]() |
Nathan Alexander![]() Inner circle 2118 Posts ![]() |
My post confused even me. I guess I see it as they can make a decent fee for sometimes offering and booking a magician when they take calls over the phone for a party (again, they don't have normal open hours. They also rent out their equipment). Some families may consider it and be appreciative of the connection.
Then I get to work as well. I like work. ![]() |
Mary Mowder![]() Inner circle Sacramento / Elk Grove, CA 3766 Posts ![]() |
I've done a few shows in Party Places (booked as a regular show not associated with the party places and performed in the private rooms). Some parents are interested in having something extra even though they've already spent to use the Party Place.
I know a Teen Magician who did two or three shows every Sat and Sun in the larger area of one of these places (which was owned by a Magician). I don't know the details of the business arrangement. His shows were well attended by all the Party Place patrons when he did these shows in the great room area. You should consider whether you'd like to be an add on for a private room or a regular Stand-Up in the large area (usually VERY noisy) or a Strolling Magician throughout. I think working the big room would use up material quickly. The Strolling Magic might be better to sell Parties on the side (unless you are just unavailable on the weekends because of the Party Place gig). Using the Strolling Magic to sort of up-sell an add on of a show in a private room might be good. I'd consider a shorter show that has no re-set at a reduced price as the regular offering. These rooms tend to be small and the party attendant who serves the cake has limited space and time do their often sticky job. You will need to check the situation to make policy on when and where you will perform in these rooms. Make sure you ARE NOT roped into being the room attendant or server. Party Places may have the same issues we have with everyone wanting to book Saturdays. You might be able to offer Your Strolling Magic as a way to add value to their Sundays while leaving your Saturdays free. Next time you are at one of these places, ask the crew a few questions about crowds and if other performers come to many of the private party rooms. If they see a lot of that, they may wish to "get a cut" . I'd love to hear if it works out (and how). -Mary Mowder |
Nathan Alexander![]() Inner circle 2118 Posts ![]() |
Wow, fantastic tips Mary, I appreciate it. (And I'll keep you posted as I attempt anything.)
|
Mindpro![]() Eternal Order 10696 Posts ![]() |
It's been a couple of days and not many responses, and I know how frustrating that can be when you're seeking direction and answers. So I will offer three posts as a reply to you.
First, I couldn’t disagree more with what Dynamike has offered you. To recap, he basically says… - Approach in a nice manner - Explain you like their venue - Explain what you do & that it'll benefit them - Tell them they are to book you & get a flat fee for doing so - Have their business market for you - Do whatever you feel is best - standup or strolling Sorry, but this is exactly what's wrong with most entertainers and their perceptions. This is a simplistic, almost laymans approach and mentality. Of course these are a given. “Do what’s best for you” - duh, of course, does that even need to be said? You are not an idiot. Again, opinion-based posts will be much different that fact or experience-based replies. Please understand which is which and the differences. |
Mindpro![]() Eternal Order 10696 Posts ![]() |
I agree with Mary, you should FIRST decide what you want and are going to do, present and approach them with. Decide either strolling/closeup or a structured stage or standup performance, not what “you” want, bit what is best or most-appropriate or beneficial to THEM. When approaching someone with an opportunity, you must:
1. Know exactly what you are offering and bringing to the prospect as an opportunity. You must know your value of this upfront and know how to express it concisely. 2. And most importantly, you must think from their interests not just yours (something very few performers truly understand). Theirs should be priority or this will likely never work out as you desire. Not only should you strive for a win-win scenario, but they must possibly benefit even more than you. You are creating a business transaction here. For someone else's business. Remember, they don’t know or care about you, they care about THEIR business and future, first and foremost. At initial glance, they will see you as “just a magician.” 3. Do not approach this from the perspective of your business (that’s obviously a given) but do so from their perspective. If you don’t know this, first take the time to research and learn this. Thinking only of your perspective is setting yourself up for failure or to get screwed in the end. You must protect your position in this. As the one thing you don’t want is to present them with a great idea, concept or arrangement, begin to establish it, and they realize that they can do it without you or worse yet, with someone else cheaper and even more profitable to them. This is where the right ideal, structure and proper value of YOU must come into play and be part of the opportunity. You need to decide and know exactly what you are offering in advance. Mary makes some great points, as this could easily take you a a direction you don’t want to go (as Mary said “Make sure you ARE NOT roped into being the room attendant or server.”) I applaud you for taking the time to ask and seek this information up front. So many times here we see guys that jump into something, mess up and then come here in an attempt to fix the mess they’ve created and to do immediately needed damage control. Good for you for taking the right approach. |
Mindpro![]() Eternal Order 10696 Posts ![]() |
This will likely be the most valuable advice you will receive on this subject. This is not theory, this is not opinion, this is not wishful thinking or something that may look good on paper, but rather a direct response and answer to what you are seeking. It is based on experience.
Mary, with her post, has inspired me to tell a story (yes, this is your cue to stop reading if your’e going to get your panties in a bunch for our negative, agenda-based friends (not Mary) as often happens). This is a space I know very well. Back in the 80s & 90s I was faced with an almost identical situation and business dilemma as you present here. Although not a bounce house venue it was a Sports Center (we used to call them a bowling alley). And it was for a Disc Jockey, not a Magician. This center had a lounge which I was trying to book our DJs into and did for a short period of time (5 nights a week for a year and a half). This was in the late 80s. Seeing more possibilities and potential from this account I was looking for greater opportunity there. Two things came out of this that I am really proud of. The greatest revolutionized recreational bowling nationwide of which I am very proud of and nationally recognized. This is not the story of that, but rather a story of the second opportunity I created, which also changed the bowling industry and is still strong and effective to this day. Please keep in mind, other than going bowing maybe once a year with my family as a kid and maybe three or four times a year with friends as a tween or teenager (we had a 6 lane alley at our church), I knew nothing of the sporting or bowling business at all at the time. A sports center (bowling alley) has several revenue sources to generate income and profit. These come mostly from league bowling, shoe rentals, snack bar/vending, arcade/video games/billiards, the Pro Shop (where you can purchase supplies, balls, bags, shoes, get your ball fitted and drilled, etc., lessons and open bowling). While talking with one of the junior managers (younger girl, night shift) I was told they were closing the Pro Shop. Retailers such as K-mart (some of you know the role K-mart played in my career, again, another story) and sporting goods stores and other big box stores were selling bowling equipment as well as mail order catalogues, so it just wasn’t profitable enough to support paying a full-time Pro Bowler to operate and maintain. I asked what they were going to do with the space? They had the actual space that was the store/shop, and also the lower level that was where the drilling and mechancical things operated, storage, inventory etc. occupied. The manager told me they weren’t sure and were considering several possibilities, one of which was leasing it out as to an outside source to operate as another Pro Shop. I remember driving home and trying to think “what could I do with that space to create a greater opportunity for me (my agency and production company) and for the venue. I pondered it for a few days over the weekend (knowing they still had 30 days beofre it was to close. I asked the manager for a meeting to ask a few questions. Now I also had met the owner of the center and he casually had told me a few things that stuck in my head like the a single bowling lane is valued at a million dollars in cost over a life time, that their electric bill was $20,000 a month, and so on. One of the things I remembered he told me was their primary source of revenue was league bowling and tournaments. Summer was the worst because there are no/very few leagues (seniors came in to bowl in weekly leagues but little else) and yet their air conditioning and expenses were the highest during this often dormant period They basically run a 9 month operation, often closing for most of the summer and only opening at 5:00 p.m (to same on utility expenses) for some possible open bowlers and shoe rentals. Knowing this information and more gathered form the meeting I had with the manager, I almost immediately came up with an idea to build their non-prime summer business as well as turn the soon to be vacant Pro Shop into a Party Room based on my agency exclusively handling the entertainment. They had a summer kids bowling league of 88 kids paying $5 a week to bowl three games for 8 weeks during summer vacation. That was it. I approached them with the concept of building a summer kids league (couldn’t target parents or adults, they worked mostly during the day, so all that was left was kids and teens) that was a fun, interactive, personal bowling league experience unlike anything else in the country, that would include entertainment, party atmosphere, trophies, food, drinks and a must-have environment that all kids would want to be part of. It was cool and all kids would want to be part of the cool. I then presented the idea that all of these kids also have birthdays, scouting banquets and events, sports, dance, gymnastics and other activities that have banquets, parties and celebrations that could all book a package in the Party Room for these events.. Well long story short (too late I know, but I gave you the warning so if you’re still reading it’s your own fault) I crafted and created a deal that was a win-win, that was mutually beneficial and mutually profitable and it was the beginning of a relationship that has lasted 27 years. A few things happened along the way. The summer program that was 88 kids when I created this, grew to over 1000 kids, three shifts a day, five days a week, with sold out or nearly sold out open bowling every weekday after 4:00 and almost all weekends. It grew to the #1 Junior (Kids) Summer League Program in the county. We were recognized by the bowling association and Bowlers Journal (industry magazine - again press & media) for this unique program we created. The Party Room concept also went wild as it was supported by all of the kids and families from our summer leagues. We drew people not just from the town of the center, bi tthey came from all of the surrounding town, even those that had their own centers. At a time where less and less kids were bowling than ever before, where video games and home computer and television were more popular than ever, we prevailed. Within a very short period of time, we had centers all over the U.S., Canada, Japan and overseas all contacting us to consult them or to come in and develop a similar program for them. The other opportunity I created came as a result of this success and became even bigger. In the end I created something they could not have come up with on their own, they could initially only do with me, and most importantly I crafted the right deal that made me an equal partner, with both regular pay from each performance as well as backend. It was a huge 36 lane center. The manger that I worked with left after several years later moving to a smaller community of only 30,000 (the original has 80,000). Her first call was to me and asked me if I would be up for the challenge of doing it again in this small house (only 24 lanes). I said “let’s do it”, I worked with her myself (by this time we worked, and still do, great together). They had no, nada nothing for a kids summer program, and yes in just two seasons built it up to well over 900 kids and profits of over $188,000 in just 90 days,before (not including) residual income (snack bar, video games, balls, shirts, etc.) and NOT including the Party Room business (just our summer leagues). The Party Room was also an amazing success running parties every day of the week with 5-10 a day on weekends! One fueled and propelled the other perfectly (because we created and had a system). Now let me tell you how powerful it is when I can go into any center almost anywhere and make the claim that in three seasons I can generate revenues of over $150k fa season for their business in their non-prime time. It gets and keeps their attention, trust me. I tell you this story to demonstrate that once again, it is the business side of what we do, the business side of entertainment where opportunity and success are created. Thinking this through and knowing exactly what you want to do, how you will execute it and what you role and their role are in the opportunity MUST be determined in advance. It has to be a win-win and more so “an offer they can’t refuse.” We must know our business, and it is much more than just performing when you start thinking about working with others, venues, etc. Of course I have similar programs for kids performers, adult nightclubs and venues, and other markets that work well too. In my trainings, seminars, coaching and mentoring I often discuss the performer’s default business model. I discuss the eternal quest of always looking for the next booking. Being on that never-ending hampster wheel of finding and generating bookings. I urge the exploration of other business models. This one is a great example. I made one sales presentation and generated continuous bookings and revenues for now three decades. I talk about creating your own opportunities and creating new markets. I have and continue to do this still to this day, which is often why I have no competition and position myself to do what others will not be able to. Have bowling centers tried to copy our program? Sure. Have they had the same success - not even close. Also in full disclosure some centers bring us in for a few years to get their program up and running optimally and strong, and then of course get greedy and break our contact or don’t renew with us, only to find their program experiences losses of 40-60% within the first season or two. Then guess who once again comes a knocking? There is a lot of information within this post. While I'm not serving it up on a silver platter (that is reserved for my coaching, consulting and mentoring students) there is enough here and between the lines to more than get you started. Hope this sheds some light on things as you (and others) move forward. I think it’s great that Nathan is opening himself up to creating his own ideas and creating an opportunity for himself and the businesses he works with. |
Mary Mowder![]() Inner circle Sacramento / Elk Grove, CA 3766 Posts ![]() |
Mindpro,
I'm glad you decided to post. Your real experience is going to be of much more benefit to the OP (and a great read). -Mary Mowder |
Nathan Alexander![]() Inner circle 2118 Posts ![]() |
Mindpro, first thank you very much , it's gold (and I'm turning this into a PDF). The value of the advice--and who it's from--is not lost on me. I absolutely agree the only thing that really matters to the business owners are their own needs. Really just themselves and their business. And they don't care about my wants or needs when it comes down to decisions for their business (which is why I'm also prepared to see how they can obviously receive as much, if not preferably more value than me--however that can happen--as that means I also come out ahead in other ways as well).
I also appreciate you took the time to relate all that, as yes, I'm looking for real experience. I'm 41, and have passed my "look at how cool I am" phases long ago (in the sense that every business should automatically know and see why, "duh" they need to have a magician, and that magician being obviously me). I understand I mean nothing to them until I can demonstrate value. They're running a business, they're busy, they have pitches on their time and money from everywhere, etc. They really only exist to support their family (rhetorically but also literally, as it is a small, family-owned business in small-town suburbs and they said as much in the paper when they opened two years ago). I just don't want you to misunderstand that I think I'm a "gift" to them and that, of course, they just can't wait to hire a magician and will be begging for my services just by me mentioning it. (That's how I got my wife however...just please don't ask her.) But that's why I see it as a (potential) win-win. If they can take advantage of a partnership, it would be only if it could benefit them. And if so, then it would mean a job for me (and I'm not greedy or stingy, I'm prepared to split however it's best for them. Those are the details I have to consider, plan out and propose, and then find a way to propose it). Once I gather the fieldwork, I can figure an approach and see what would make sense to all. Direct mail package? In-person? Both? Flat-fee? Referral? Split payments on set prices? I'll have to consider focusing my options to offer and think it through thoroughly so I don't waste their time. I'm flexible and maybe they will surprise me on their own. Either way, I came here to see how others have or would approach it. Great stories, and valuable insight Mindpro. Obviously people here have had mutual partnerships before (like restaurant magic performers) and I'm not treading new ground. I'll give it some thought from what you folks have said and go from there. I don't want to be unprepared and be that guy. ![]() Thanks all for the great answers. |
Mark Boody Illusionist![]() Inner circle 1376 Posts ![]() |
Quote:
On Feb 4, 2017, Mindpro wrote: Mindpro Wow!!! Thank you for being so generous with YOUR EXPERIENCE! I'll take the word of a man with experience over a man with a theory everyday of the week! I believe Nathan (and others) will take these words to heart and apply them. This is probably in the top 3 posts I have EVER read! Thanks again. (Thank you is not really enough, but it's all I got for now) Mark
Only he who can see the invisible can do the impossible. Frank L. Gaines
|
Gerry Walkowski![]() Inner circle 1450 Posts ![]() |
Mindpro,
Your most recent post was absolutely brilliant. You are the man! Gerry |
cafecheckers![]() Regular user 126 Posts ![]() |
This is a great topic and discussion. Mindpro shares a great deal of insights to consider. We looked at partnership opportunities with bounce houses as well. In doing so, we were not able to create a reasonable proposal to date, but did pick up on certain realities - much of which Mindpro covered. First, in many ways they view live entertainment as competition, not a supplement. They have various profit centers and any proposal would have to show them incremental business on the space used vs their current use of the space/time, so you really need to understand their business. Your commitment also has to exceed your profits of your current use of that time commitment. Even if you get a positive response to your proposal, it will be a short run if it under delivers. The places we visited do not have themed events (Halloween, Christmas, 4th of July) because they focus on kids birthdays as the special event, so that removed that angle. In the end, it is interesting because (for us) it was he right demographics - but we would need a bigger vision to make it work.
|
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Offering to partner with a local indoor bounce house (12 Likes) |
[ Top of Page ] |
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2025 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.15 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < ![]() ![]() ![]() |