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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Polly wants a cracker... » » Holding the dove loop in place (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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KSMagic2007
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Missouri
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Hey guys,
Does anyone have any suggestions on how to hold the dove loop to your coat so that you can find it every time and the steal comes off cleaner? I have tried several things including tape and bulletin boeard clips.
Thanks,
Kyle
Bill Hegbli
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Fort Wayne, Indiana
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Use plastic tape by 3M. Put the tape on then pull the line up several times. This will remove some of the sticky from the upper half of the tape. When ready to produce the tape will stay behind on your jacket.

The tape is 3/4" wide, only use a 1/4" wide piece per string. You may be able to still get General Grants line holders to be sewn into your jacket. These are a type of hair clip.
PyroJeffNic
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I use velcro, Its 90% effective
retrostylemagic
sperris
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Peter White sells loop holders that work excellent and I also have my own design available. Both are toally failsafe, mine is just a modification of Peter's. Its not velcro, magnets, tape, it is all self contained within your jacket and there's no funny movements to dislodge the loop.

sperrys
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Cody S. Fisher
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I have tried just about everything over the years...here is what I finally came up with and I love it!

For all my bags and invisible harnesses I have a tiny magnet that is sewn inside a small circle of black cloth. The catgut loop is also sewn into this small circle of fabric.

Inside both lapels of my jacket there is a metal strip sewn into the facric. The little magnet holds the catgut loops perfectly in place. It is almost 100% effective for me...well I've never had a problem with it. Also I use General Grants "Dove Looper" in order to give my loops that perfect shape. It's almost too easy now!

Anyway, I hope this helps,
Cody S. Fisher
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Mr. Muggle
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Most ways to hold your loop in place have already been stated. I wonder though, what type of loops you use & have you shaped them to form around your jacket?

My bottom loops didn't need any holders after I bent them properly, but that also depends on your jacket/vest setup.

I don't know if this helps you any or not, but thought I'd mention it.

MM
"Now you're looking for the secret... but you won't find it because you're not really looking. You don't really want to know the secret... You want to be fooled." - The Prestige (2006)
KSMagic2007
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Missouri
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Thanks for all the imput guys!
MM,
I am shaping my dove loops with general Grants dove looper, and I am usin a standard dove. The invisable harness and pocket that I use both come from Tony Clark. As an additional note, does the material that your loop is made of affecet the method that you should use to hold the loop to your coat. I am currently using fishing line that is sprayed fkat black.
Kyle
Dave Scribner
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I agree with Dan. Peter White's holders work everytime. I made my own with his permission and if you use wire loops, they are the best. You can adjust the tension for each loop and there's no chance of it coming loose during the act.

Scotch tape can come loose or come out with the dove.
You can still get Gen Grants holders but you can get them in any grocery or cosmetics store. They are simply a hair clip.

Cody, I hadn't heard of a magnetic loop holder but yours sound pretty good.
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KSMagic2007
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Missouri
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Sperris,
How well do your loop holders work with 6 lb. test fishing line wich has been sprayed flat black, and shaped with General Grants dove looper?
Kyle
Dave Scribner
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Kyle, the loop holders Dan and I have described are for loops made of wire.
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Cody S. Fisher
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Dave,

Thanks for the kind words concerning my dove hookup. It has served me very well!

Cody S. Fisher
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Lou Hilario
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Cody, what kind of magnets are you refering to? Are these neodyme magnets? What shape and how small? Thanks.
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Bill Hegbli
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Loops are usually 10# clear fishing line. You do not have to paint them, if you want to a marker pen does a permanent job. Or you can run them thru very find sand paper to take the shine off them. If your line is out of shape, put them between two towels and put your iron on low and run it across the the line. You get a perfect shape that will stay. Use thin towels.

Some performers perfer wire, this can be gotten at any hardware store for picture hanging and crafts. It comes in flat black. These can be bent around the lapel for a more secure fit. another wire method is to keep the loop out of site. See the Shamada tapes for the method.

I perfer the fishing line that has 2 contact points on each side to the doves head instead of the single connection below the doves head.

If you are using an invisible harness it is best to use the fishing line, as these require longer lengths.
Dave Scribner
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The wire loops can still be used for longer length requirements. Using the Peter White holders, the wire loop is attached to the holder but a length of nylon or flexible line runs from the holder to the bag or harness.

The wire loop doesn't necessarily have to bend around the lapel. In my settup, I have one loop that sits flush against my shirt, which is black, or my cumberbund. Two of the loops are set just as a nylon loop would be and only one wraps around the lapel.
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g0thike
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I highly recommend Dan Sperry’s Loop Gimmick. I personally use them myself.

For dove bags scotch tape will hold the loops on the lapels but the tape may fail with the movements that you make during the show.

Velcro is nice but if you do invisible harness productions and the bird moves in. The loop will sink into the Velcro and you won’t be able to recover.

Personally I have never tried magnets so I have no comment.

Wire loops wrapped around the lapel do work fine BUT they appear visible on TV appearance or anywhere that you can’t control the lighting or when you are close to the audience. Their excellent on stage with the audience about 15 feet away or more.

My advice buy Sperry’s loop gimmicks their only $10.00. The loops can be placed flat on tthe inside of your jacket and they stay there. Peter White is hard to get a hold of and he charges $50.00 for a set, Sperry charges $10.00 a piece.

P.S.

The picture on his site of the gimmick is blacked out so that he doesn't expose the gimmick.

G0THIKE
Darcy
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I agree, Dans loop holders are great!! I find that they hold the loop in place tight but is still easy to release. They are the perfect holder!!!
KSMagic2007
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Hey guys, what are the benefits that wire holds over fishing line (cat gut)? Also, I checked out Dan's site and noticed that he recommends 28 gauge flat black wire. He says that it is the thinest that there is. I am wondering how visible this would be? (compared to 6 lb test fishing line)
Kyle
Dave Scribner
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Kyle, gOthike explained the disadvantage of using wire. Up close it is visible but then up close so does monofilament line. If you're working up close, you can always position Dan's or Peter White's holders so the loops are held inside the jacket instead of outside. The 28 Guage black wire is the best if you're going to use wire loops. Some of the advantages of wire are you don't have to heat it give it shape or retain it. It can be bent around the lapel if you want, you don't have to paint, sand, dab with magic marker since it's already black.

To gOthike's point about the wire showing on TV, that will happen if you bend the wire over your lapel. If you let it stick straight out of the jacket and over the cumberbund, it isn't noticeable. I wear a black or very dark shirt which makes it even easier to cover up the loop.

I'm not sure of the exact construction of Dan's holders but you can make one almost identical to Peter Whites for about $2.00. Check out the hardware or craft store. You'd be amazed at what you can find that will work as a loop holder. Think about small hinges with the pin removed to get you thinking on the right track.
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KeirRoyale
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Denver, CO
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I also use magnets. Buy some of the black material that is used to patch clothing by ironing it on to fabric. Place the magnet between the patch and your coat, iron it in and viola'.
sperris
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Quote:
On 2004-04-02 06:59, KSMagic2007 wrote:
Sperris,
How well do your loop holders work with 6 lb. tes fishing line wich has been sprayed flat black, and shaped with General Grants dove looper?
Kyle


The loop holder I made can be used with both wire as well as fishing line, that's the one improvement I made on the gimmicks.

sperris
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