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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Hot off the Press! » » Bicycle Elite Edition Playing Cards (Rider Back) (4 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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MagicBarMan
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They came in and are already out again. Does anyone know of any other “thin crush” style of card like the Elites that have a softer broken in feel?
Powell
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Niva asked if these faro well. Yes, they do, but not nearly as well as Gold Seals, not least of all because they are "crushed," thereby being a bit thiner than Golds. I do one-handed faros with both hands, have about a 20% hit rate with perfect one-hand faros in each, so I know of what I write. Also do perfect table faros nearly 100% of the time. The Elites work for this, but I like the Golds better.
For regular faros, either should be perfect.
I hope this helped.

~ Brian Foley
"A card is not a brick."
- Dai Vernon
Carderrez
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I realize this is an old thread. However I think I have some information to contribute as well as a question about the Thin Crushed, Web Press stock. I believe they come with similar gaff cards to the Elites, but may or may not be a fraction of a millimeter thinner per card.

I do not consider myself an expert on playing cards, but playing cards are the primary focus of my magic. Understanding the cards I use is vital to creating gimmicks, gaffs and practicing sleights.

My favorite working decks are the Gold Standards and the Elites. However knowing why needs to go deeper than they just feel good. I need to know why. Now that I have all the facts sitting right in front of me I felt I should share what I have discovered.

I really started to get serious on the topic when I established a new practice routine. I knew what I liked to work with, but I also wanted to be sure to work cards more difficult to handle. That is when I found the Expert Playing Card Superior Robusto. These are the cards I begin my practice with.

The Robusto has a density of 96.46 grams and 52 cards are 16.5 mm. These cards by far have the highest molecular density I have ever encountered. They are difficult to work with which makes them the perfect deck to start off with in my practice rotation. They remind me of the rear suspension springs on a motor vehicle. They have spring to them, but you wouldn't know it unless significant force is applied, and this can only be done by holding the cards at one extremity to achieve the spring necessary to riffle shuffle the opposing ends. Its takes significant finger strength to just dribble them.

The next deck is the Gold Standard they have a density of 86.76 grams and 52 cards are 15.4 mm thick. These cards have the same thickness as a retail Bicycle 808, but have a higher molecular density. These cards have much more spring to them than the Standard Retail Bicycle 808 which is a spongier card at 84.46 grams.

I then move over to the Elites, which is a real eye opener for 52 cards at 14.4 mm thick they have a density of 85.26 grams which is one gram less in volume than a Gold Standard and a little under a gram more than retail Bikes. These cards have a higher molecular density than the Gold Standards but they are thinner.

Lastly I shift to the retail deck. Which I have pretty much covered 15.4 mm thick at 84.46 grams. Taking a single card from the Gold Standard or the Elite and comparing the spring to a single retail 808. They feel porous the spring more like that of a sponge.

I worry less about the finish on the cards (although I know this matters), buy the time I get done practicing with them they are pretty worn, and I push them beyond that point to push myself.

I prefer to use both the Elites and the Gold Standards as far as handling is concerned depending on the effect. I use all three grades for gaffing and gimmicking depending on the effect.

The Expert Playing Card Superior Robusto is my warm-up deck. If I can perform a slight with the Robusto, I can perform it with any deck, and in the off hand chance I am handed a deck with similar properties to a Robusto performing impromptu. I will know my limitations.

That leads into the final thought. I practice will all of these decks, so in the real world challenge of impromptu I am vetted.

I do not recall if I have tried to split the Elites, but I don't think there is much benefit unless the point is to extract the core. I don't think there is any significant difference in the thickness of the outer layers between the Bicycle decks.

Again I am sharing this information because I ran the numbers on these decks, but my main reason for posting is to find out if anyone has worked with the Thin Crushed, Web Press stock and compared it to the Elites. Are they the same stock or is there a notable difference?
Carderrez
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Since my last post I have received a brick of the "Thin Crushed Stock" 52 cards measure at 14.3 mm thick and weigh 84.5 grams .76 grams less the Elites but are only 0.00576923076 mm thinner per card. They appear to be using the same molecular porous core as a retail Bicycle deck. They have similar spring to the Elites out of the box, but I believe because they are using the more porous core the spring will not last as long. I do not see any real advantage over the Elites unless maybe for gaffing or some very specific effects and/or some very specific handling.
Carderrez
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I thought I would run the numbers on the Conjuror Community Deck and found it measured it at 15.5 mm thick for 52 cards and 86.4 grams, those numbers indicate it using the same or similar core as the Gold Standards or the Elites. Another deck that has garnered recent attention is the DMC Elite v5 these measure in at 15.4 mm an 84.6 grams and appear to be similar card stock to the retail Bicycles.

I hope this information is helpful. I have learned over the years especially when it comes to gaffing, mixing the right card stock can help to create a more perfect gaff or gimmicked deck, and these numbers come in handy for this. And of course depending on the effect and the handling required some decks perform better than others and it's just a good to practice with all the gradations to find the best fit.
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