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thomasR
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Asking for money day of show is very common in the professional market. Major concerts (im talking about arena shows, theatre shows etc.) typically settle with the promoter after the show. (I tour full time with major concert shows).

All of my contracts with the variety shows I produce (almost exclusively with consumer level, as they are city planners, company employees, Etc. Who do not plan entertainment professionally) state payment is due in full at the conclusion of the last performance. In 10 years, I don't think this has ever been an issue although some have done a direct deposit.
TomBoleware
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I agree, it's not uncommon at all to ask for payment up front.

It's also not uncommon at all for a company to understand that a stranger will require such payment.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

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WDavis
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Quote:
On May 9, 2017, TomBoleware wrote:
WDavis, at what point would you have declined?

At the show?

Tom


He was told at the event he wouldn't be paid.at that moment is when you start renegotiating the contract, get signatures etc. if I can't get an executed amendment then, I walk. I immediately follow up with an email to the department head stating my disappointment on the outcome of the engagement and wish them success in future endevours.

I have had situations like this before, and it's by walking away and the respectful letter of disappointment, I've received calls from the real buyer of my service and their personally involvement to rectify or correct the matter from occurring again.
TomBoleware
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Quote:
On May 9, 2017, WDavis wrote:
Quote:
On May 9, 2017, TomBoleware wrote:
WDavis, at what point would you have declined?

At the show?

Tom


He was told at the event he wouldn't be paid.at that moment is when you start renegotiating the contract, get signatures etc. if I can't get an executed amendment then, I walk. I immediately follow up with an email to the department head stating my disappointment on the outcome of the engagement and wish them success in future endevours.

I have had situations like this before, and it's by walking away and the respectful letter of disappointment, I've received calls from the real buyer of my service and their personally involvement to rectify or correct the matter from occurring again.


Thanks Walter.

Yes I can see that happening. But when it’s never happened to you before I can also understand thinking, I’m here already why not hope it works out. We sometimes learn the hard way I guess Smile

I have a friend that booked Willie Nelson for a local opening here last year. Not only does he require upfront big bucks he demands it all be in cash.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

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Dannydoyle
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Tom why do you keep contradicting people who actually do this? You will never learn, we get it. But please stop hindering others from learning.

This is not about your ego out your inability to stop posting or pretending you are the world's foremost authority or telling stories about your imaginary friends. This is important and will cost people money to think so short sighted like you. You are not helping anything. Just please stop. You don't know everything and in this case you know woefully little.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Ken Northridge
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Quote:
On May 8, 2017, Dannydoyle wrote:
….often they are on net 30 or net 45 with invoices.


As Danny pointed out early on page one different companies work in different ways. It may be completely normal for this company to pay 45 or more days later no matter what the contract said. They may not have even read the contract! If so, this is not even a cause for concern yet because it hasn’t even been 30 days.

Dealing with schools is something I know about. I state on every contract that the agreed upon fee is due after the performance. However, many schools will not even begin the payment process until after the performance. Sometimes I have to wait 3 months or more. Sometimes I will politely remind them that I haven’t been paid yet and ask is there anything I can do. I’m not bugging them or insinuating they are doing something shady.

I always get paid. No need for concern.

Different ways to do business in different markets.

The private party market I treat differently. I state on my confirmation letters (no contracts here) that there is no money due until after the show and only if they are completely satisfied.

I always get paid (except for an extremely low percentage of bounced checks. Like 2 in 25 years) So, no need for concern here either.
"Love is the real magic." -Doug Henning
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Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On May 9, 2017, Ken Northridge wrote:
Quote:
On May 8, 2017, Dannydoyle wrote:
….often they are on net 30 or net 45 with invoices.


As Danny pointed out early on page one different companies work in different ways. It may be completely normal for this company to pay 45 or more days later no matter what the contract said. They may not have even read the contract! If so, this is not even a cause for concern yet because it hasn’t even been 30 days.

Dealing with schools is something I know about. I state on every contract that the agreed upon fee is due after the performance. However, many schools will not even begin the payment process until after the performance. Sometimes I have to wait 3 months or more. Sometimes I will politely remind them that I haven’t been paid yet and ask is there anything I can do. I’m not bugging them or insinuating they are doing something shady.

I always get paid. No need for concern.

Different ways to do business in different markets.

The private party market I treat differently. I state on my confirmation letters (no contracts here) that there is no money due until after the show and only if they are completely satisfied.

I always get paid (except for an extremely low percentage of bounced checks. Like 2 in 25 years) So, no need for concern here either.


I had no idea schools operated in that fashion. The only time I ever dealt with schools is in post proms and the agency paid me not the school. That is interesting.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
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Ken, I think a delay can be expected when dealing with local State or Federal officials.

Private Companies may have forty different pay procedures but if you are calling the shots the way you should be, they will play by your rules regardless of their normal polices.

Danny you can dance around all you want, but pay up front means pay up front. But you right I am just repeating myself.
Hopefully everyone gets it and wont be mislead by you. I will stop now, you should too.

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

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Ken Northridge
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Quote:
On May 9, 2017, TomBoleware wrote:
Private Companies may have forty different pay procedures but if you are calling the shots the way you should be, they will play by your rules regardless of their normal polices.


Of course they SHOULD! But a certain amount of flexibility on the performers part will go a long way in getting a repeat booking. Its all about a positive experience from first contact to final payment.

As I said, when I have someone paying late, I don't assume they are trying to screw me. I just assume the company may not have all of the right people in the right places. A few friendly reminders is usually all it takes.
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Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On May 9, 2017, TomBoleware wrote:

Danny you can dance around all you want, but pay up front means pay up front. But you right I am just repeating myself.
Hopefully everyone gets it and wont be mislead by you. I will stop now, you should too.

Tom


Not just me.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Decomposed
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Okay got an update. I called again today and talked to the woman who just answers the phone. I was extremely polite and spilled out the story. She mentioned the male I spoke to and I told her (not knowing he is now out of the country) that I had already tried him but have not heard back. She then transferred me to a woman who handles invoices. Yea! Anyway to make a long story boring, she is moving on it. Crazy system they have The pay actually comes from India. She had no invoices from me or W9s. So I emailed all that and my correspondence with the woman who hired me. She actually promised to handle it and apologized more then once. COMMUNICATION! I received an email this afternoon and it she said payment is scheduled for the 25th of May and said that was the best she could do at this point. I told her that was great and now I am in their system, it was a lovely gig and all that.............................damage control. But, wheels are moving! Smile

Please everyone stop bickering! Smile

Decomposing Paycheck Due to Inflation and India Smile
Dannydoyle
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Like we said in the system. Makes perfect sense.

Glad to hear it.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TomBoleware
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Glad to hear it and its good to see she apologized.

Tom

You know what to do after the 25th. Smile
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

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Mindpro
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Quote:
On May 9, 2017, TomBoleware wrote:

You know what to do after the 25th. Smile


Not a D@#N thing! If payment is scheduled to be processed the 25th you will likely see it in 7-10 days following that (perhaps more if coming from India.) So NO, you would do nothing on the 25, 26th or anytime after for at least a couple of weeks. Tom's thread should be titled, the best way to lose an account and your reputation with a client. Such a terrible way to do business. Such terrible advice.
Mindpro
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Seems my insight into this matter was pretty spot on. Glad you feel better and as I believed you will see your check. I'm guessing they only process these once or twice a month. If processed on the 25th it is usually for the 30th or end of the month run of expenses, payroll, etc. When I had my radio station (and several other of my current businesses) we did the very same - payroll on the 1st and 15th and only the last period of the month was for/included expenses, miscellaneous invoices, reimbursements, etc. We only did it once a month as well.

Tom, out of all the great information in this thread, the apology (by a nobody, low level phone operator who has nothing to do with the transaction or knows nothing about any facet of this) is the only thing you focus on? So sad.
Mindpro
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Quote:
On May 9, 2017, thomasR wrote:
Asking for money day of show is very common in the professional market. Major concerts (im talking about arena shows, theatre shows etc.) typically settle with the promoter after the show. (I tour full time with major concert shows).

All of my contracts with the variety shows I produce (almost exclusively with consumer level, as they are city planners, company employees, Etc. Who do not plan entertainment professionally) state payment is due in full at the conclusion of the last performance. In 10 years, I don't think this has ever been an issue although some have done a direct deposit.


I agree, many professional markets, especially those that are that are gate/door-reliant do settle immediately following the performance. One of the take away points is all markets are not the same consumer and/or professional). Most of the information I have referred to was about specifically about the professional trade show market. It is also important to point out in the type of pro market gigs you mention a much more complete contact and terms (and rider) is usually clearly stated and in place.
TomBoleware
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Mindpro, that add on comment I made was another joke referring back to the gun story. You need to come down to the real world.

Sounds to me like that 'low level phone operator' is the one that handled it well.

Still my guess is he doesn’t care that much about doing business with those that take forever to pay after being accustomed to being paid that day. But yes, if he wants to go that route, waiting is ok.

So please, don't anybody go hiring a gunslinger on my account. Smile


Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

Tom Boleware
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Decomposed
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Yeah and she emailed me again today. It seems everyone was out of the country, or out of the office on the same weeks when I attempted to get in touch with them. There are so many forms associated with payments, one being an exception form. Smile
TomBoleware
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Walter was probably right, you should have walked.Smile

Just curious but did that cross your mind there at the show?

Tom
Do What Others Do And You Will Become Average

The Daycare Magician Book
www.amazekids.com/magic-downloads/childrens-magic-ebooks/the-daycare-magician/

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Dannydoyle
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I love the guy who never performs adding sarcastic comments to the guy who does.

Tom being sarcastic to Walter doesn't make your position correct.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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