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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The spooky, the mysterious...the bizarre! » » Heads up - The Kube. (8 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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the Sponge
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Quote:
On May 23, 2017, RCP wrote:
Quote:
On May 22, 2017, the Sponge wrote:
The other issue, I don't see mentioned here, was that he wasn't adding anything new to an already populated effect. It wasn't improved or different.


When has that standard every been enforced? Do you hold Murphy's to that standard?


That question is really secondary to the argument and has no bearing on the argument.

But to respond to it, creators/distributors are supposed to vet these things before working them out/selling them. Creators get chastised for crap/similar releases on here often. And dealers/distributors will do whatever makes them $$.
He was asking for support to produce something to sell. To get interest levels. and he got it.
People were just focusing on the other (probably over the top) exposure reason, and I just wanted to remind people of the other argument. Some posts here make it sound like he had created something new and amazing and Penny beat him for the way he chose to roll it out. Which is only partially true.

s
Necromancer
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Quote:
On May 23, 2017, RCP wrote:
Yourself, the magic dealers and the magic community in general exposed (sold) more "secrets" to the public than this poor gent. He was treated very shabbily.


I appreciate that you want to defend your friend, RCP. But your logic has become circular. (And I'm not sure what you mean by "shabbily." Nobody called him names or accused him of being a horrible person. He was called out for exposing the secrets of marketed items on a website aimed at laypeople, where they could be stumbled upon accidentally.) To refer back to my original response to you on May 20:

Quote:
There's also a world of difference between secrets that are discovered through active searching and those that the public can bump into accidentally, without looking for them. I understand the former (without such searches at my local library, I wouldn't be performing today). The searcher is rewarded with a secret after some amount of work (perhaps less because of technology, but the onus is still on him); it accords some value to the material.

The latter scenario, conversely, requires nothing of the viewer and only devalues our craft.
Creator of The Xpert (20 PAGES of reviews!) and the Hands-Off Multiple ESP System ("Quality and design far exceed any ESP cards on the market"-Genii), both at Penguin.
RCP
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Two Minnie's in The Hell's Half Acre, The Republic of Texas
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He is not my friend Neil, we have never meet nor had a conversation. Perhaps you didn't see the vitriol leveled at him, thus the thread disappearing. I wouldn't advocate Kickstarter being the prime location to advance a magic product but it's far less exposure than many other sources. Magic has thrived because of exposure not been harmed by it. Just ask the dealers and those selling their secrets. 😉
Necromancer
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Perhaps I missed that part. And I agree: if that's what happened, it's uncalled for.

Quote:
On May 23, 2017, RCP wrote:
Magic has thrived because of exposure not been harmed by it. Just ask the dealers and those selling their secrets. 😉


I don't see the marketing of material within the fraternity to be exposure in the same sense of the word. Evidently, on this we will differ.
Creator of The Xpert (20 PAGES of reviews!) and the Hands-Off Multiple ESP System ("Quality and design far exceed any ESP cards on the market"-Genii), both at Penguin.
RCP
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Two Minnie's in The Hell's Half Acre, The Republic of Texas
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Not to belabor the point Neil but the public didn't have to actively search out "secrets" when Penn and Teller or the Masked Magician showed all the "secrets". I remember the hysterics over that as well. Magic didn't die. David Copperfield and Lance Burton thrived right down the street using the same "secrets" that were exposed. You are a successful performer not because of "secrets" but because you provide disbelief and that is the secret none can expose......not even on Kickstarter.
Necromancer
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RCP, I agree with you that providing disbelief is critical. But as I said before, one can't create the most powerful experience of magic for a lay audience if the mystery behind it isn't also preserved.

And you are correct: The Masked Magician's exposures didn't kill magic—but they certainly affected the repertoire of working illusionists, costing them thousands in material they suddenly couldn't use and had to replace at least temporarily. (I've read accounts from several of them, though not from Copperfield or Burton.) That's before trying to assess the incalculable damage of training the public to think that once they know the secret of an effect, that's all there is to magic and magicians. It's not good for any of us.
Creator of The Xpert (20 PAGES of reviews!) and the Hands-Off Multiple ESP System ("Quality and design far exceed any ESP cards on the market"-Genii), both at Penguin.
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