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phonic69 Special user 560 Posts |
What techniques do you employ when learning a stack? Do you use mnemonics or create stories? What works best for you?
I ask this because I am learning the Aronson stack right now, and I wondered if I was learning it effectively. Thanks for any help you can give me, |
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gio Loyal user Genova - Italy 247 Posts |
I've used the mnemonics suggested by Aronson himself in "Bound to please" and it works fine for me.
Gio |
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phonic69 Special user 560 Posts |
Whilst I am not one to argue with the inventor of the stack(Aronson's techniques are fine), I believe that you cannot apply a universal technique of memorization for everyone. We all learn in different ways, and so I was interested in how other people memorize a deck.
Gio, did you find Aronson's mnumonics easy to remember, or did it take a lot of time to master? |
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Scott F. Guinn Inner circle "Great Scott!" aka "Palms of Putty" & "Poof Daddy G" 6586 Posts |
Personally, I prefer rote memorization, particularly for a "random" stack. You have to remember 104 things: 52 cards and their 52 positions. With the mnemonic systems you have to remember 208 things: the cards, the numbers and the word associated with each card and number.
That's why I really like the Joyal Stack. It uses 14 rules to remember the whole stack. In a little less than 2 1/2 hours, I could set the entire deck up by memory (admittedly, I have an excellent memory). The best way to improve your memory is to exercise it! One of the reasons I have such a good memory is because as a kid I went to a church and a Christian school where I was required to memorize lots of Scripture passages. So I'm used to memorizing.
"Love God, laugh more, spend more time with the ones you love, play with children, do good to those in need, and eat more ice cream. There is more to life than magic tricks." - Scott F. Guinn
My Lybrary Page |
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Tom Cutts Staff Northern CA 5925 Posts |
Agreeing with Scott, exercise is the key to a strong memory. I use the Kevin Trudeau Mega Memory System which goes beyond basic mnemonics, is applicable every day, and is, by nature, personalzed and so easily utilized.
It also has some scary coincidences with the Aronson Stack. IE Ace of Spades is called "The Bullet", right. It appears #6 in the stack, right. #6 in the Trudeau system is gun (six shooter). See how easy it can be! So, what's in the gun? Where is the bullet? You just finished your first card using Mega Memory. Congratulations! |
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Mark Ennis Inner circle Raleigh, NC 1031 Posts |
Harry Lorayne's memory techniques (ie - The Memory Book) will come in handy if you choose to learn them. He uses techniques like the "peg system" and if you are able to master the memory techniques, this will help you with other things besides memorizing your stack.
ME
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flourish dude Inner circle from ? But I know where I am going! 1195 Posts |
Quote:
On 2002-07-08 12:28, Scott F. Guinn wrote: Scott where do you find info about this stack?
Nothing of the same will bring any change, take action today!
Just taking a step, is a step in the right direction because when you stop working, your dream dies. www.magicalmemories.us |
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wayman Special user England - Sunderland 589 Posts |
The Joyal stack can be found here
Click to Learn |
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Greg Arce Inner circle 6732 Posts |
I, too, love the Six Hour stack and use it all the time. It's easy to learn and gets the job done. Do yourselves a favor and learn a stack, any stack and you'll be glad you did.
Greg
One of my favorite quotes: "A critic is a legless man who teaches running."
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Darrin Cook Special user 621 Posts |
Scarne's book of magic tricks and The Encyclopedia of Card Tricks both have the same mnemonic system. I'm using it right now for "Deep Astonishment."
1 = l 2 = n 3 = m 4 = r 5 = f/v 6 = b/p 7 = t/d 8 = ch/sh 9 = g/k 10 = s/z This is a thumbnail sketch. This system has applications to mentalism. |
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Scott F. Guinn Inner circle "Great Scott!" aka "Palms of Putty" & "Poof Daddy G" 6586 Posts |
Quote: Martin Joyal's book, The Six Hour Memorized Deck, published by Steve Minch's Hermetic Press in Seattle, is available from most dealers. Try http://www.discountmagic.com for a great price and super service. Tell 'em Great Scott sent you!On 2002-07-08 13:58, flourish dude wrote:
"Love God, laugh more, spend more time with the ones you love, play with children, do good to those in need, and eat more ice cream. There is more to life than magic tricks." - Scott F. Guinn
My Lybrary Page |
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gio Loyal user Genova - Italy 247 Posts |
phonic69, I found Aronson's mnemonics easy to remember but I changed some associations that I didn't "like" (I couldn't remember easily) with some easily remembered (for me!).
It took me about a month to learn the stack "perfectly". Now I don't even remember some mnemonic I used! ... I can just associate the stack-number with the card and the other way around "automatically". Gio |
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flourish dude Inner circle from ? But I know where I am going! 1195 Posts |
I am going to get it! thank for all your help.
Nothing of the same will bring any change, take action today!
Just taking a step, is a step in the right direction because when you stop working, your dream dies. www.magicalmemories.us |
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J R Thomas Regular user Champaign Illinois 138 Posts |
Phonic69....
To paraphrase nike...you just do it... While we all learn in different ways essentially our memories work the same...some kind of association...everyone I have talked to who has learned the aronson stack using his technique talk about the associations falling away until you associate the number with the card ...Plato did say "Education is Recollection"...Dittos Scott Guinn on the Notion of the Mind being a Muscle (paraphrasing something I read in a John Lennon Biography)....I have found the more I exercise my memory the better I get at it and the better I feel mentally... So phonic69....don't knock it until you have given it a couple of weeks...Why reinvent the wheel before you have riden on it for a while....Then you'll be brushing your teeth with Simon every morning..... on another note....does anyone know what flourish flourish dude is performing in his little picture?
Those who hear not the music
Think the dancers mad |
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Scott F. Guinn Inner circle "Great Scott!" aka "Palms of Putty" & "Poof Daddy G" 6586 Posts |
I believe it's a variation of Ten Ichi's "Water Cascade." Developed by his jealous rival, Eleven Ichi, it's known as the "My New Fire Cascade Kicks Ten's Lame-o Water Cascade's Butt!" It was Eleven Ichi, by the way, who first coined the phrase, "On a scale of one to ten, I'd give it Eleven!"
Your friend in the pursuit of serious historical documentation, Scott
"Love God, laugh more, spend more time with the ones you love, play with children, do good to those in need, and eat more ice cream. There is more to life than magic tricks." - Scott F. Guinn
My Lybrary Page |
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WilliamWHolcomb Special user Twinsburg, Ohio 533 Posts |
Reading through the posts got me a little interested in the memorized deck. Besides doing something such as "Sam the Bellhop" what other effects are possible with a memorized deck? Where could I find information on the web for such effects?
Thanks in advance...
William Holcomb
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Greg Arce Inner circle 6732 Posts |
William the effects are endless. Look up all the Aronson books and you'll get tons of effects with a memorized stack. Some need to use his stack, but most will work with any stack. The more I play with the stack the more I like it. Think about this: you have several people cut and look at the card they cut to, they also shuffle the small pack of cards they cut, you fan their small pack of cards at them and never look at the face of the cards... after you've done that you begin to call out all their cards.
Greg
One of my favorite quotes: "A critic is a legless man who teaches running."
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Dennis Loomis 1943 - 2013 2113 Posts |
To William,
Actually, the Sam the Bellhop routine cannot be done with the Aronson Stack or the Tamiriz Stack, but requires that you learn the story, and then set the deck up in that order. As you work on it, the story becomes easy to recall and then it's easy to set up any deck when you want to do it. I've used a similiar story trick for years, called "Diamond Jack." Eugene Burger did it on an early video, but it's not original with him either.
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com |
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Dennis Loomis 1943 - 2013 2113 Posts |
Again, to William,
As Greg says, there are tons of tricks that you can do with a memorized deck. It's a powerful tool that can be used in conjunction with many effects. For example, I have several effects where I need to force a specific card. Before I started using the Aronson stack, I had to find that card, and then get it to top or bottom for most of the forces I know. But, with a memorized deck in hand, you can force any card at any time, and it's quite easy. Let's say, for example, that I'm doing the Birthday Book trick. A spectator tells me that their birthday is on July 10. That tells me that I have to force the 17th card which is the 3 of Spades. I don't want to have to sight count all the way down to the 17th card, so I cut the deck, just trying to cut about ten or eleven cards from the top to the bottom. It doesn't matter how close I get, because I'm going to be able to adjust very easilly. As I square the deck I glimpse the bottom card. Let's say I see the 8 of Diamonds. I immediately know I cut off nine cards. A little shy of what I wanted, but no problem. Now I begin to spread the deck, knowing that the top card is number ten. I push them in blocks of three, counting as I go. 10, 11, 12 in the first push, 13, 14, 15, in the next push. I know the 3 of spades is now just two more cards, and I cull it under the spread. As soon as I do, I get the spectator to touch any card they want as I continue to push cards over. When they touch a card, I separate the cards so that their card goes onto the bottom of the right hands cards. But the culled card is under it. I just square the cards in the right hand and tip it up so they can see their freely selected card. (?) This may sound complicated, but it's really not once you have memorized the deck and know how to cull a card under the spread. There's actually an even cleaner version of this, created by Mike Close called the MC Spread Double Lift. But to learn that, you'll have to buy either Mike's Videos or his Worker books. And this is only one simple use for a memorized deck.
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com |
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phonic69 Special user 560 Posts |
Will, for me, buying Aronson's books has been the best decision I've ever made in magic. The effects are truely stunning, and in my opinion, far stronger than any slight of hand! |
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