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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Deck the Halls » » Copag 310 (2 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Ejwhite25
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How do the copag 310 playing cards handle of you have them?
o.
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The new thin ones are one of the best, handling wise..
EndersGame
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Depends which version you mean.

The Copag 310 decks were first produced in Cartamundi's B9 True Linen Finish. This is thicker card-stock than a typical USPCC (e.g. Bicycle) deck, but also soft and more supple.

More recently, after their supplier of that paper stock went broke, they've switched to card-stock that is thinner than a typical USPCC deck, and is called their E7 finish. This is also very soft in handling, almost too soft. If you buy a Copag 310 deck today it's likely to be with this much thinner stock. Cardistry folks like it, but for card magic you might find it too soft.

For a much more complete discussion of the difference between these two card stocks, see my article on the subject here, which should tell you all you need to know about how the Copag 310 decks handle:

The Cartamundi Decks: A comparison between finishes

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Jonmaddgician
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After months of handling, I'm gonna come out & say it.

Cartamundi > UPSCC

There. I've said it.

Initially I was really impressed with the original thicker stock Copag 310s, & when I found out they changed to the new Slimlines, I panic bought like toilet paper & stocked up on the last 22 decks I could find on ebay. However, since handling the newer thinner versions of their Copag 310 decks, I must say I am just as impressed. That "buttery smooth" feel that YouTube magicians seem so fond of using takes on a whole new meaning when handling Cartamundi playing cards (Copags, Cobras, Cohorts, Marble) to the point that when I went back to my Bikes for working gigs, they felt kinda stiff & rigid in comparison. A simple side by side card spring comparison should give you a clear indication of the soft flex of the Copags compared to the more snappy sound of a Bicycle deck. Granted I don't use perfect faros much in my work, & my style uses more misdirection & timing over expert handling (I would consider my sleights a bit sloppy), so I can't comment on their performance for more technical handling.

In terms of durability, I've found them to be extremely hardy (in dry Western Australian climate) & my deck has been used for over a month now as I am also testing quality for a custom print run (more on that experience later in another post sometime...) I tend to be quite careful with my deck though, often straightening up bent corners as I find them, reverse riffle shuffling to make sure it's not bent like a banana too much one way, & also I do chuck the deck in a card clip every week or so whenever it needs a bit of an "ironing". On a side note, the old thick original Copags seem to reset after a bit of storage & fan very nicely even almost a year since opening. Time will tell if they're as smooth & long lasting as my blue seal Arrco deck that lives in my car glove box, subject to the occasional 40+ degree (celcius) Perth summers...

Basically yes, I think I am a Cartamundi convert, & will probably put out a YouTube video comparison sometime in the not so distant future, but from the irregularity of my posts on this forum & YouTube channel, can't guarantee how soon. Smash a like & reply to this comment if you're keen so I get a feel for how important this might be to people... =P
EndersGame
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It's great to get feedback like this, thanks for sharing your experiences Jonmaddgician.

I do like Cartamundi's Slimline decks, but wonder if they are almost a bit too soft for card magic. I do find it quite telling that you mention the need to be careful and often to straighten bent corners. When doing sleights like an Erdnase Change, and even a double lift, there's a real risk of bending the cards, which is less of an issue with a USPCC deck. I'd be curious to hear more for you on your experience with that, Jon.

One real strength of Cartamundi's decks is that they are printed very accurately. USPCC decks often have misaligned borders.
Jonmaddgician
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I'm actually in the process of printing my own custom deck with Cartamundi at the moment, & am having some issues with the process a bit (partly my fault for not triple checking). I'll make a separate post when I'm done with the whole process, but because I had forgot to remove the guide lines when I uploaded my design, it actually makes it much clearer how off centred & inconsistent the cutting was in my case. More importantly, I also realised that there was an overlap of the yellow & blue inks that produced a weird green on 11 of the 12 court cards. Am in communication with the company now to try to resolve these issues. Fortunately it was all in my prototype print run.

With regards to the softness of the cards, I also do straighten out corners (from corner crimps & pinky pulls & culls) & banana deck bends with my USPCC decks (from riffles & bridges) as well. There is definitely a slightly softer touch to my DLs, especially as I like to handle them in the opposite corners (a little noticeable tell that I'm trying to wean myself off), but I tend to keep them in a bit of motion as well to cover up (is there really a perfect DL, though?). The slightly more rigidness of a USPCC deck though means that the cards do give each other a bit more support & possibly handle a bit easier, but also I am with the school of thought of not being afraid to practise or perform with a lousy deck. Cartamindi (& their flagship Copag310s) are certainly not a lousy deck though, & in the long term I think are going to give Bicycles a good run for their money, not that they're really in direct competition anymore... =P
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