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Magic Mark
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I'm a long time lurker and I've recently had my passion for magic reignited. I'm finding myself craving the effects that I performed in my youth which, unfortunately, I sold or gave away long ago.

I picked up an 8-inch set of Linking Rings at a recent IBM Ring 76 swap meet. I got a great deal on them and I've been having fun reacquainting myself with them. And I'm finding myself curious if the set was manufactured by Rings N Things or maybe Bumper?

Here's a photo of the set:

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-FfhM......Mb49.jpg

The rings have a little bit of musical ring to them. They aren't as musical as the Proline rings (heard in a video on YouTube) but, to my ears, sound about the same as Owen rings (I am NOT suggesting they are Owen rings, just that they sound similar to Owen rings I hear in videos).

Perhaps a helpful identifier, they also have obvious "burn" marks where they were suspended during the plating process. Here's a closeup of one of the burn marks:

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-PgZW......WtL7.jpg

They also have obvious grind marks where the welds were smoothed. Here's an example of that:

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-JG7j......jn9F.jpg


I had a set of 10-inch Enardoe Tru-Tone Rings in my youth. I do not remember the Enardoe Rings having any obvious grind marks but maybe I'm remembering wrong? When I first started playing with these rings the tones they make seemed "familiar", perhaps similar to the Enardoe Rings I owned?

The set came in a red zippered storage bag with a handle. The bag is very dirty but, other than the dirt, it looks like this one:

https://thumbs.worthpoint.com/zoom/image......a966.jpg

The bag may have been from a different set, it doesn't have any kind of label (not even under the handle).


I'm hoping a Linking Ring aficionado/collector might come along and offer an expert opinion. Did Rings N Things Enardoe Tru-Tone sets have obvious grind marks under the chrome plating? Burn marks from being suspended during plating? Bumper rings?

I only paid $5 for the set and I'm thinking I'd rather have a 10-inch set. I would like a set that is a little better quality than this set (preferably no obvious grind marks or burn marks) but I'm not interested in spending $50 per ring for Prolines either.

BTW, I checked out a set of 8-inch rings at my local magic shop today. My goodness were they thin compared to these! And almost zero musical ring by comparison. It seems there SHOULD be a market for a decent quality set of mid-priced rings. Why is that so difficult to find these days?

Suggestions for a quality 10-inch set that isn't insanely expensive?

Thanks!

Mark
Bill Hegbli
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The bag is the original Rings and Things Company, There have been 3 R & 3 companies. They may be Rings and Things I set. The grind marks is not from manufacturer but from either bouncing them on concrete or putting in vice. The mark is not burn mark, they are usually black not cloudy white.

Here is a very good set of 12" great value for the asking price.
https://tricksupply.com/product/chinese-......a-trick/

You are interested in buying at a time, when the market is just not making linking rings. Everyone wants larger and larger rings, above the old standard sizes.
Harry Murphy
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A 10-inch set that might just meet your needs:
https://www.magictricks.com/linking-rings-10.html
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
thomasR
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Around 1992? my parents bought me a set of 8" linking rings from magic masters. I'm not sure who made them, but I still have them and they are a wonderful set. I agree it is a shame you can't buy a decent set for a decent price anymore. I ordered a 12" set online a few years ago and they are so thin and flimsy I would never ever want to perform with them. I've since bought a used set of Owen 12" rings complete with locking feature and they are worth it. I'm sure ProLine and a Porper Rings are great too (heard the ProLine Lock is easier to use... would love to get a set one day).
Magic Mark
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Quote:
On Nov 22, 2018, Bill Hegbli wrote:
The bag is the original Rings and Things Company, There have been 3 R & 3 companies. They may be Rings and Things I set. The grind marks is not from manufacturer but from either bouncing them on concrete or putting in vice. The mark is not burn mark, they are usually black not cloudy white.

Here is a very good set of 12" great value for the asking price.
https://tricksupply.com/product/chinese-......a-trick/

You are interested in buying at a time, when the market is just not making linking rings. Everyone wants larger and larger rings, above the old standard sizes.


Thanks, Bill. The Vincenzo Di Fatta set is one I am considering but, so far, I've not been able to check out a set in person. I'm concerned they will be too thin. The 8-inch set that I purchased is 1/4-inch steel. That is fine for 8-inch rings but I'd want thicker steel for larger rings. And, unfortunately, the retail sites don't list the thickness of the Di Fatta rings.

Magic Mike Stilwell is a friend (many may remember his persona of Bumper the Magical Bunny). Several decades back he teamed with Suds and manufactured a variety of effects, including various sizes of linking rings. I gave him a call last night to ask about the $5 set of rings I purchased last week. I described the "flaws" to him and he felt pretty confident that they are a set of their rings. He said they sold thousands of sets during the years they were in business (they were the exclusive supplier to Disneyland for many years).

Mike said he might have a 10-inch set laying around and promised them to me if he's got them. But, since we talked, I've been watching various routines on YouTube and I've become smitten with Whit "Pop" Haydn's 4 ring routine. So much so that I purchased the downloadable video from his website. I've watched about half of it so far and it has me wanting even larger rings. 12-inch at minimum. The Di Fatta set might be the ticket if they are thick enough (and cleanly manufactured) but I am extremely hesitant to order them completely sight unseen.

One thing my wife reminded me about last night when I told her about my ring shopping quest... Most of the time it makes more sense to buy the top quality item in the first place. If you buy something that is inferior just because it is cheaper you may eventually end up getting the more expensive item anyway. Meaning, sometimes it is "cheaper" to buy the good stuff right away.

So, I've sent an email to Owen to inquire about the price of their rings. They are located about 120 miles from me and I may decide to drive up there to check them out in person.

Mark
Magic Mark
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Quote:
On Nov 22, 2018, Harry Murphy wrote:
A 10-inch set that might just meet your needs:
https://www.magictricks.com/linking-rings-10.html


Thank you, Harry. I sure wish it was easier to know exact specifications for every product. Why EVERY manufacturer or retail site doesn't list thickness, metal, etc is beyond me.

Mark
Magic Mark
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Quote:
On Nov 22, 2018, thomasR wrote:
Around 1992? my parents bought me a set of 8" linking rings from magic masters. I'm not sure who made them, but I still have them and they are a wonderful set. I agree it is a shame you can't buy a decent set for a decent price anymore. I ordered a 12" set online a few years ago and they are so thin and flimsy I would never ever want to perform with them. I've since bought a used set of Owen 12" rings complete with locking feature and they are worth it. I'm sure ProLine and a Porper Rings are great too (heard the ProLine Lock is easier to use... would love to get a set one day).


I'm even considering the ProLine rings but I've read several comments in the forum from folks that have had a bad experience dealing with ProLine. A 12-inch 8 ring set would be $400 from ProLine and, for that kind of money, there should NEVER be a bad experience. The negative comments make me quite hesitant.

Mark
Walking Bob
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Mark

Do a search for Redefine Rings. I have a backup set that is like new, 12 inch hollow stainless. They look exactly like Owen rings, which I also have. Ring tone
is similar but I would say that neither Owen or Redefine ring like a bell. Should mention that this is the standard 8 ing set.

Let me know if interested but do a search first to see what you can find.

Have a great day,

Walking Bob in Iowa
thomasR
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I think the Owen Rings are around $100 each new. I was in your same shoes e-mailing pro-line but concerned with the bad experiences others had posted. While debating on the Pro-Line's I got a good deal on a used set of Owen Rings.

I think your wife is right, if you want a quality set of rings you will probably only be satisfied with ProLine, Owen, or Porper.

Can you still order the redefine rings?

Also... glad you purchased Pop Haydn's ring routine, it really is the best of the best.
Magic Mark
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Quote:
On Nov 22, 2018, thomasR wrote:
I think the Owen Rings are around $100 each new. I was in your same shoes e-mailing pro-line but concerned with the bad experiences others had posted. While debating on the Pro-Line's I got a good deal on a used set of Owen Rings.

I think your wife is right, if you want a quality set of rings you will probably only be satisfied with ProLine, Owen, or Porper.

Can you still order the redefine rings?

Also... glad you purchased Pop Haydn's ring routine, it really is the best of the best.


Yikes, if Owen rings are $100 each new (12-inch) then that would definitely slow me down on that plan. I figured they'd be closer to the price of ProLine rings.

Mark
Magic Mark
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Quote:
On Nov 22, 2018, Walking Bob wrote:
Mark

Do a search for Redefine Rings. I have a backup set that is like new, 12 inch hollow stainless. They look exactly like Owen rings, which I also have. Ring tone
is similar but I would say that neither Owen or Redefine ring like a bell. Should mention that this is the standard 8 ing set.

Let me know if interested but do a search first to see what you can find.

Have a great day,

Walking Bob in Iowa


Thanks, Bob. I sent you a PM.

Mark
Bill Hegbli
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Trick Supply is owned by Wolfgang Wollet, he is a long time magic dealer, who knows magic. He has always went beyond any other magic website to help me get what I desire.

My point is, if you ask Wolfgang, he will give you the measurements if he can. He is not a drop shipper, he actually has a warehouse full of magic. So email him or give him a call.

Yes, as I remember now, the suds rings did have the stain on some of them, once in a while. So you may have a have that brand, but that is definitely a Rings and Things carrying bag. I use to own one, I liked the round design, it kept the rings from juggling around during transport.

Owen's ring in 15" will cost you a bundle, if they will make them. They will be a lot more then $100 each, that was some years ago, and they increase their prices every year.

You have a lot to think about as it is.

Take a look at Stevens Magic for good quality rings as well, be prepared for sticker shock. They have 22 inch rings as I remember, as well.
thomasR
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Owens makes 8, 10, 12, and 15" rings. Last year they were still in the $100 per ring range... I think the 15" is like $115 or $125 per? Or maybe that's for the locking ring?
Either way it's in the $100 per ring range. That's what Porper charges too.

Proline are gonna be the best for the money, you just have to be prepared to wait a few months for them.
Magic Mark
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I've settled on 12-inch, no larger. Decisions, decisions...

I'm not a working pro, this will strictly be for hobbyist use. Although that makes it difficult to justify the prices for the hollow rings (stainless or aluminum), the other side of that coin is I have more disposable cash than I had in my younger days. Sometimes we just want to spoil ourselves.

That said, I have to admit I'm wishing that I could try this set in person before spending the money:

https://www.magictricks.com/linking-ring......ass.html

(Thank you, Harry, for the link to that vendor)

Those are stainless, no chrome plating, but solid steel. If they are only 1/4-inch in diameter then they will feel too narrow for a 12-inch ring. If they are 3/8-inch in diameter, that would be about the right size but they may be too heavy. But it's not like I'd be doing multiple shows in a row.

Mostly I'm scratching a nostalgia itch. I've already shown my wife a few parts of Pop Haydn's routine using the little 8-inch rings and she was liking what she saw. I don't *need* larger or better rings, they are a want.

I've just got to decide how much I want to spend on the want.

Thank you, everyone, for your thoughtful replies!

Mark
Magic Mark
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After a very nice Thanksgiving meal I sat down to digest my food and all of the linking ring information I've consumed since last night. Walking Bob made a very generous offer to sell me a set of his backup 12-inch Redefine rings and I've decided to take him up on the offer.

Thank you, again, Bob for offering such a nice deal to a fellow magi. I'm pretty darn excited to receive them, it will be Christmas in late November! Smile

And my thanks everyone else for taking the time to reply to my topic, much appreciated!

Mark
blackstone99
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The Owen rings I have had for about 20 years are one of the best investment I have made in magic apparatus. There are no visible seams or even the slightest blemish on the stainless steel.

Paul
Magic Mark
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I've read (another site) that the Redefine rings can have a very slight blemish in the area of the welds. So, I'm prepared to see/experience that when my rings arrive. But the person also said the blemish is only visible upon very close inspection. If that's the case I can certainly live with it at one quarter the price of Owen rings.

Today I ordered Pete Biro's book, The Real Secrets of the Chinese Linking Rings, from Penguin. I'm looking forward to immersing myself in the history of the effect.

Mark
Magic Mark
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In case anyone is wondering, a 12-inch set of 8 linking rings (standard key) new from Owen is now $875. Wow!

My Redefine rings from Bob are scheduled to be delivered today. We get our mail fairly late in the day but the carrier is running a little later than normal. Patiently waiting (well, somewhat impatient). Smile

Mark
thomasR
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Porpers website now lists the 4-ring 12" set at $500.
Magic Mark
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Just realized I failed to post an update... I received the Redefine 12" rings from Bob. Bob gave me a terrific deal on the rings and they are, indeed, gorgeous. Easily, the best quality linking rings I've ever handled. And, although they probably don't "ring" like the ProLine rings, they absolutely sound amazing. They sound exactly as I expected and they are a joy to handle. Very wonderful quality magical apparatus at a very reasonable price.

That said, I have to admit that, initially, I was ever so slightly disappointed with a couple of the welds on the Redefine rings. On two out of eight of the rings the welds are visibly a little poorer than the other six rings. With those two rings, when they are spun on another ring, there is an audible "clunk" sound as the weld spot spins over the other ring. If all of the welds were of the quality of the other six rings, there would be nothing to mention except near perfection. It was just a little disappointing that two of the eight weren't quite up to par with the other six.

This is NOT a negative comment toward Bob. I am a bit OCD and I have a tendency to notice even the slightest imperfections in a product, it is a curse. It's not the type of imperfection that would make one whit of difference in an actual performance. In fact, for all I know, even ProLine or Owen rings might have these ever so slight imperfections at their welds (or some of their welds)? Someday I hope to handle a set of ProLine or Owen, just to satisfy my curiosity.

I am VERY grateful to Bob for the great deal on the Redefine rings. These were less than half the price of buying the ProLine rings and about one quarter the price of the Owen rings. Bob included the shipping in the asking price and shipped them very promptly. In the couple of weeks since receiving them I have been having fun learning Pop Haydn's routine and am enjoying Pete Biro's book. I'm a happy camper. If I had it to do all over, even knowing about the slightly imperfect welds, I would buy this set again. Thank you, Bob!

Mark
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