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Michael Rubinstein
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This may seem like a stupid question. Typically, three coins are together and the gaff is removed as one coin (say the silver) and changes to the other two (the foreign coins). Are there any routines where 4 coins are in play,(the extra coin is always hidden) and two foreign coins (not the gaff) are removed from the hand with three coins, and changes into the third coin? I hope that is understandable.
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inigmntoya
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This is not quite what you're describing, but is a novel use of the gimmick.
https://www.artofmagic.com/products/the-atomic-coin
Tom G
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Jeremy Pei put out Ultimate CSB in which he explored different ways to use the CSB, not sure if anything like that is on there.
funsway
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I do have a CSB routine (Three-For All) that employs a forth coin, but the audience only knows of three - and only atd the beginning and end.
It has six sequences with some resembling coins across, another 'Two in pocket' and the others a variety of transpos and switches.

No taking of two coins like I think you are asking, but could be added or replace a sequence with a change in story line.

At least the combinations of sleights and moves may suggest the result you are seeking.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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David Neighbors
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Yea I think I had something Way Back in my Coinjurering Video Around 35 - 40 Years Ago. I would have to go back and look to be sure!
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J-Mac
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Cody Fisher has a routine that uses the gaff + silver half, plus two real foreign coins that are ditched at some point. "Real World CSB".

Jim
Ray Haining
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Cody Fisher starts his routine with two non-gimmicked foreign coins, which he has examined by the spectators. He switches them for the gaff (in their foreign coins incarnation) and goes to his pocket for the non-gaffed American silver coin, leaving the two non-gaffed foreign coins in his pocket, never to be used in the routine again. (There's actually a second set of non-gaffed coins used, but I'm not going go into that.) It's the routine I use.

I think Michael Rubinstein is looking for a routine that uses a fourth coin that is integral to the routine itself, which is an interesting idea in that it opens up new possibilities for the CSB set.
funsway
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Here is a quickly routine outline of what might be done as a modification of my routine indicated above.
Obviously, I was intrigued enough by Doc's question to have a restless night.

CSB Fandango

A multi-phase coin routine in which the selected coin(s) are taken from the open palm rather than any “reach in,” uses coins handled by spectators and loaned to the performer, deviates from the normal CSB patterns, with results that bemuse the performer.

At the start, the spectators handle and hold a basket of various coins and small objects from which requested coins are selected. The performer announces he needs a mixture of contrasting coins of the same size.

1. He requests a coin with a hole in it and is handed a Chinese coin (B). This is taken in the right fingers, examined and passed to the left fingers.

2. a darker, brownish coin is requested and B held forward to indicate the size. This is taken by the right fingers and examined and identified as a Mexican Centavo (C). I will call this one “Juan” and the other “Lee.” The indicated coins are displayed on the fingertips of the two hands far apart.

3) a silver coin is requested with Lee again held forward for size comparison. The offered half dollar is taken by the now empty right fingers as everyone notice both Juan and Lee are mysteriously on the left fingers. No comment is made as the silver is examined and announce to be a Kennedy half and named “Phil.” This is placed next to the other two coins on the open left fingers.

4) Phil leaves his new friends for a music lesson – the S taken from the left fingers to leave Juan and Lee on the open left fingers. Phil goes into the right pants pocket with the hand returning empty.

5) with a rubbing motion of the left thumb the palm is exposed to reveal all three coins on the open fingers.

6) Lee (B) is taken and carried to the right pants pocket. Then Juan (C) is taken and dropped into the left breast shirt pocket, leaving only Phil (S) on the open left fingers.

7) repeating the rubbing motion the left fingers are exposed to reveal Juan and Lee but no Phil – gone! The surprised performer glances about and then shrugs.

8) Juan (C) is taken by the right fingers leaving Lee (B) alone on the open left fingers.

9) the rubbing is made in both hands. When the palms are displayed the two coins have swapped places – Juan (C) on the left fingers and Lee (B) on the right fingers.

10) Lee (B) is placed in the right pants pocket as the performer again glances around. Phil (S) is extracted from the breast pocket and placed next to Juan (C) on the left fingers. A spectator is asked which coin he believes to be more powerful.

11) Phi (S) is taken and placed in the right pants pocket. The remaining Juan (C) is displayed on both sides in a quizzical manner and dropped into the left palm.

12) after the rubbing motion the hand is opened to display all three coins. There are dropped in the basket one-by-one or handed to spectators to return.

NOTE: other sequences can be added in the middle as desired. Only the complete CSB set is used: Gaff coin and a matching Chinese, Mexican and American coin. Several sleight are involved that are not part of instruction that came in the box. Smile
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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funsway
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As a diversion in a more standard routine, the three coins are shown on the left palm.
The copper and brass are taken away or placed on the open right hand,

With no closing of the fist or toughing of the hands, the left suddenly is empty and all three coins are on the right open palm.

"I guess they don'l like bring apart. Maybe if I just take the silver away ..."

Uses the SwayOn sleight and would create anticipation over what will happen next, with the aquitment of showing both hands empty
and illustrating that only two coins are in play. Of course, the gaff is nested and the silver and copper are extras at this point.

One key to such routines is the property of the Gaff to serve as a split C/B or a single silver or copper or brass.
Many sleights popular for a C/S gaff can work with this gaff serving as a B/S or a B/C.

I do not know if there is a name for flipping the leaf over during a Twirl or Take action.

The psychological ploys of Continuity of Motion, Predictive Vi/son, Contrast Bias and Attention Blindness and others all come into play too.

So, become very adept at performing standard CSB handlings before adding embellishments.

I tend to rush things too much in such routines - hope you'all can avoid that error.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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Michael Rubinstein
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Thank you all.
NEW MANUSCRIPT - TWILIGHT ZONE WILD COIN. All New!! As seen on Penn and Teller Fool Us! PM for details!
Rattle purse 2.0 now available! PM me for details!
New FOUR hour Penguin Live lecture TWO with 23 NEW routines, available for download at: http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/7338
Penguin Live lecture One is THREE hours long, and contains 18 coin effects! Available as a dvd or download from Penguin at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/5960
New York Coin Magic Seminar dvd series available for download at: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic/magic-dvds/new-york-coin-magic-seminar-downloads/
NEW!! At The Table 2 hour lecture download OR DVD containing 11 routines, including THREE never taught before! Download and dvd avaliable at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22380 or http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22833
FlightRisk
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A quick note about Jeremy's version, he has his gaffs with a hidden addition inside. He has a great hidden web page that shows all the gaffs he has used over the years which is also a nice comparison of the quality of different manufacturers. I have found him to be very kind and helpful.
Michael Rubinstein
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Flightrisk, thanks, I will need to look into that. Ray, I am working on a routine where the gaff and all three normal coins are in play, with one coin always hidden so that only three are seen at any given time. . In this way, the gaff can be used a bit more subtlely...instead of the silver turning instantly to the two foreign coins, adding some SOH you can expand on that. More difficult, but imho more interesting.
NEW MANUSCRIPT - TWILIGHT ZONE WILD COIN. All New!! As seen on Penn and Teller Fool Us! PM for details!
Rattle purse 2.0 now available! PM me for details!
New FOUR hour Penguin Live lecture TWO with 23 NEW routines, available for download at: http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/7338
Penguin Live lecture One is THREE hours long, and contains 18 coin effects! Available as a dvd or download from Penguin at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/5960
New York Coin Magic Seminar dvd series available for download at: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic/magic-dvds/new-york-coin-magic-seminar-downloads/
NEW!! At The Table 2 hour lecture download OR DVD containing 11 routines, including THREE never taught before! Download and dvd avaliable at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22380 or http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22833
Degio
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Mr. Rubinstein, I'm really looking forward to seeing what you are creating. I also believe that the CSB is underutilized; while there are hundreds of different routines involving a CS gaff (and different levels of SOH), the CSB gaff is more or less used always in the same way, with limited SOH.
Jeremy Pei has done some great work there: his CSB Interchange routine (within Ultimate CSB Magic) is beautiful, but requires an extra gaff.
A routine with 3 regular coins + 1 CSB gaff (more subtly in play) would get much closer to the legendary Latta CopSilBrass.
I guess Mr. Neighbors has developed something along those lines... gosh I can't believe I'm writing to such coin masters...
Ciao from sunny Italy
funsway
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Quote:
On Mar 8, 2019, Michael Rubinstein wrote:
I am working on a routine where the gaff and all three normal coins are in play, with one coin always hidden so that only three are seen at any given time.


Just a suggestion based on several routines I have explore ...

Once you have an extra secret coin in play and the sleights to expand variety, the specific feature of the CSB gaff becomes less important.
Any Exp [ that fits over several coins will serve, and the results can be very impressive.

I have one routine called 'China Spice' that uses a Kennedy half, matching Exp [, English Penny and two matching Chinese coins (I use Blue for greater contrast)

Happy to send it to you for inspiration. I am sure you can come up with something better.

A second advantage is working with coins on the open palm with no weird "reaching in" to extract a coin.
I played with adding a C/S gaff but it did not seem to add much over the suggested handling.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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Ray Haining
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David Regal, in Approaching Magic, has two routines (Brass-Ackwards and Strolling Abroad) using the CSB gimmick that are different from your usual run-of-the-mill versions. In each routine, he uses the gimmick and matching regular coins. Michael, if you haven't already, you might want to check them out.
Michael Rubinstein
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Thanks Ray, Funsway, thanks for your offer, I am really interested in routines that use a particular sequence, not just any routine that is different from standard use. But I thank you for your offer!
NEW MANUSCRIPT - TWILIGHT ZONE WILD COIN. All New!! As seen on Penn and Teller Fool Us! PM for details!
Rattle purse 2.0 now available! PM me for details!
New FOUR hour Penguin Live lecture TWO with 23 NEW routines, available for download at: http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/7338
Penguin Live lecture One is THREE hours long, and contains 18 coin effects! Available as a dvd or download from Penguin at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/5960
New York Coin Magic Seminar dvd series available for download at: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic/magic-dvds/new-york-coin-magic-seminar-downloads/
NEW!! At The Table 2 hour lecture download OR DVD containing 11 routines, including THREE never taught before! Download and dvd avaliable at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22380 or http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22833
funsway
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I may have something in my files, but am now confused as to what you are seeking. I guess I thought you were looking for an end result rather than a method/

"Are there any routines where 4 coins are in play,(the extra coin is always hidden) and two foreign coins (not the gaff) are removed from the hand with three coins, and changes into the third coin?"

I read this as two different request, one for routines with an extra coin in play, and secondly for the removal of the two foreign coins as a sequence.

What is not clear is what happens to the liver left in the holding hand. Does it vanish, change back into the two coins or something else?
Can the removed coin(s) be gaffed in a different way? As part of a routine, what is to happen next?

Please note that in my suggested routine above, steps 6-7 do have both foreign coins removes and the remaining silver changed back into the two coins.
Where the silver winds up or is revealed can be adjusted according to the follow up sequences.

So, is the silver to be changed into the two foreign coins? The two removed coins changed into the silver?
Is it to appear as a simultaneous transposition, or can the events be asynchronous? Can this occur in spectators' hands or a container such as purse or Okito Box?
I could see adding your rattle purse to hold the two removed coins. Suddenly the rattle stops and the silver is dumped out --
all eyes then jumping back to the open left hand holding two foreign coins. Could even happen with a spectator holding the purse.

I am intrigued by the addition of this sequence to a CSB routine (or other routine using mixed coins).

It remains to be seen if the removal of two coins before the transpo is seen as more powerful magic than the standard sequence.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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funsway
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Ok Doc - your fault!

Here I am lying in bed bemused by the strange darkness of 6:00AM because of daylight savings. One less hour of rain, anyway.

Three different coins. Need to move the two foreign one at once. Enter the rattle purse instead of pocket. Here goes!

1) purse removed from pocket and three coins dumped into spectator's hand. Empty purse set on table.

2) the spectator places the copper, silver and brass coins on my left palm.

3) without closing left hand I remove the silver and drop into my pocket. Hand removed empty to pick up purse.

4) purse waved over the two foreign coins on left palm. Now there are all three coins visible.

We have now established the Pattern of Performance. Purse empty. Right hand empty. Three different coins that like to be together.
Left hand never closes. All coins have been handled by the spectator.

5) this time the brass coin is removed and taken to the pocket leaving the silver and copper visible on the left palm.

6) the magic purse is waved over the hand and the Chinese coin has returned - all three visible on the open left palm.

7) instead of trying with the copper coin, a change-up is suggested. The spectator is given the purse to hold and it is opened.

8) the copper is dropped inside. Then, with shrug, the brass is taken and also dropped into the purse and snapped shut.

9) the silver is alone on the open left palm. The spectator shakes the purse to show that the two coins are still there.

10) she waves the purse over your palm and the silver changes to the two foreign coins. She opens the purse and extracts the lone silver.

11) the performer take the brass and drops it into the purse. Then the copper is tossed into the air, caught and dropped in also -
or the spectator drops in the silver and then picks up the copper and adds it to the purse.

the purse is returned to your pocket

all you need is a silver coin, brass coin, copper coin and the CSB gaff -- and the rattle purse. Any purse can work but will skip the rattle acquitment.

Such fun! Yes, a couple of additional sleight are required, but nothing too difficult.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



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Michael Rubinstein
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Funsway, very creative!
NEW MANUSCRIPT - TWILIGHT ZONE WILD COIN. All New!! As seen on Penn and Teller Fool Us! PM for details!
Rattle purse 2.0 now available! PM me for details!
New FOUR hour Penguin Live lecture TWO with 23 NEW routines, available for download at: http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/7338
Penguin Live lecture One is THREE hours long, and contains 18 coin effects! Available as a dvd or download from Penguin at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/5960
New York Coin Magic Seminar dvd series available for download at: https://www.vanishingincmagic.com/magic/magic-dvds/new-york-coin-magic-seminar-downloads/
NEW!! At The Table 2 hour lecture download OR DVD containing 11 routines, including THREE never taught before! Download and dvd avaliable at http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22380 or http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/S22833
ottphd
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Check out Luis Piedrahita CSB
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