The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Mnemonica Trainer by Rick Lax (30 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3~4~5~6~7~8 [Next]
paperinick
View Profile
Inner circle
my faro is starting to look nice after
1124 Posts

Profile of paperinick
Quote:
On Mar 10, 2019, Waterloophai wrote:
It is not my intention to break down the flash cards of Rick Lax.
But the truth has to be said, because the concept of a memorized deck is too dear to me.
Flash cards are not a bad learning tool (although, but one of many possibilities).
But ... flash cards you have to make YOURSELF with "images" that you have fantasized YOURSELF.
If you learn flash cards from someone else, you lose an important part of the learning process.
Conclusion: flash cards made by someone else can indeed be a learning tool, but are far from ideal. I even doubt that someone who does not even have the creativity to make flash cards HIMSELF, is the right person to learn an MD. (but the latter is a personal opinion)
Let it be very clear: I have nothing against Rick Lax. On the contrary. Normally his products are very good and he is a (very) good teacher (but no expert in the memorized deck like me Smile ).
About this product (the efficiency of it), I have my reservations.

I agree, if it's not personal it won't help unless some of the images kind of relate to yourself.
We will see.
I am down to 26 cards with the peg method, but I realized that the images will fade while the associations card number still stick.
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death my right to say "scr*w you" if you persist. [Voltaire Smile]
alee7371
View Profile
New user
52 Posts

Profile of alee7371
Just to clarify no flash cards need to be made using Lax's method. He has created images and associations that make it easier to remember which is all on the video.
Though I do believe this works I guess only time will tell.
no2ss
View Profile
Loyal user
California
246 Posts

Profile of no2ss
Quote:
On Mar 10, 2019, Waterloophai wrote:
It is not my intention to break down the flash cards of Rick Lax.
But the truth has to be said, because the concept of a memorized deck is too dear to me.
Flash cards are not a bad learning tool (although, but one of many possibilities).
But ... flash cards you have to make YOURSELF with "images" that you have fantasized YOURSELF.
If you learn flash cards from someone else, you lose an important part of the learning process.
Conclusion: flash cards made by someone else can indeed be a learning tool, but are far from ideal. I even doubt that someone who does not even have the creativity to make flash cards HIMSELF, is the right person to learn an MD. (but the latter is a personal opinion)
Let it be very clear: I have nothing against Rick Lax. On the contrary. Normally his products are very good and he is a (very) good teacher (but no expert in the memorized deck like me Smile ).
About this product (the efficiency of it), I have my reservations.


I agree. This can work, but I think the more personal, the better. That said, this could still work for some. I picked up The Memory Arts last year when I decided I wanted to start doing MD work and I found it a useful introduction on creating a memory palace, but I didn't use their images. Rather, I used their ideas to then create one for me, involving stuff I know already (a trail I walk nearly every day), and that's proven to be much more useful long term. The book was still useful to me in grasping the concepts, but then you need to make it your own to get it to stick. If people can do that with Rick's system, that could be useful (though, frankly, I like the idea of using a broader memory palace, because then I can use it for other memory work, or multiple MD stacks).
boinko
View Profile
Elite user
Illinois
410 Posts

Profile of boinko
I wholeheartedly recommend this.

Essentially -- and I'm not giving anything away here -- this method creates an image for the card (including the suit) as well as the *position in the deck* for the card. What's interesting -- and what I find, actually, pretty powerful is that it doesn't rely on a "memory journey" like Memory Arts. You memorize the image for the value -- and then you combine that image with an *action* and then an image for the position. So for each card you have a (a) value image, (b) an action, (c) and a position image. You could call it 'VAP' (as opposed to PAO for full deck mem work). So long as you memorize the V image for each card -- and know the images for each P -- you'll automatically get it. You know, for example, that the 4 of clubs is in position 1 because, well, you know what the 4 is -- and you know what the suit is (or, actually *does* -- the action of the clubs) -- and you know what position the suit is doing its work on. The suit is the verb (or noun, in the case of a diamond) -- but it's the suit that always links to the position.

Rick teaches the V's first -- the images for the values -- and then goes through each card in the stack order to produce the full VAP. The "A" is a verb in the case of clubs, hearts, spades -- and a noun in the case of a diamond. But that's fine. It's visual enough -- and effective enough -- that the suit always feels like an "action".

Really -- this is very, very good. I wanted to like the Memory Arts -- and I memorized the journey -- but I always felt (for me, at least) it was an effort. This, on the other hand, clicked. And within 48 hours, I had the whole deck down.

Now, I'm using the mnemonica trainer app (not Rick's) to get up to speed on my iphone.

BTW -- I like the odd, off-color images. (The 2 of hearts, for example.) Offensive? Yeah -- sure -- but the more offensive and bizarre and "dirty" an image is (I'll always go over the top with the 6, for example) -- the more it will always, always, always stick in your mind. Offensive is good. It sticks. That's how you memorize this stuff. If it's offensive, you remember. If it's benign, you forget. It's that simple.
Poof-Daddy
View Profile
Inner circle
Considering Stopping At Exactly
4673 Posts

Profile of Poof-Daddy
I ordered it to try. To be fair, I have tried many systems thru many years. Harry Lorayne’s system never clicked. It was the first I tried using his books and even audiobooks of his book several times while driving truck cross country. I tried Mnemonica method from the book, no luck there. Aronson, same outcome. Even just repeating over and over didn’t get it. But, The Memory Arts Book clicked “FOR ME”. They even tell you you can replace their images with graphic, adult, NSFW... images of your own and that does help IMO. I also use the “Ultimate (Aronson, Mnemonica) Trainer” apps. The stack I chose to learn thru the Memory Arts Method was Aronson but I will give these a shot at learning Mnemonica.

I think people should keep trying different methods until they find what works. I know I can still use Memory Arts to learn Mnemonica but for the price, I am totally willing to give this a try and if nothing else, I will be informed of yet another methods pros and cons. Smile

I look forward to the journey.
Cancer Sux - It is time to find a Cure

Don't spend so much time trying not to die that you forget how to live - H's wife to H on CSI Miami (paraphrased).






Smile Smile
Martin.Lester
View Profile
Inner circle
1010 Posts

Profile of Martin.Lester
Strange a Download is on Pre Order even though it already has 23 Reviews !
Poof-Daddy
View Profile
Inner circle
Considering Stopping At Exactly
4673 Posts

Profile of Poof-Daddy
Quote:
On Mar 11, 2019, Martin.Lester wrote:
Strange a Download is on Pre Order even though it already has 23 Reviews !

As posted before in this thread early on, you get the download and teachings immediately upon ordering, you are just waiting for the actual cards to be shipped. You can get enough of an idea from the download to post initial thoughts as a review.
Cancer Sux - It is time to find a Cure

Don't spend so much time trying not to die that you forget how to live - H's wife to H on CSI Miami (paraphrased).






Smile Smile
erichoudini
View Profile
Regular user
105 Posts

Profile of erichoudini
Thanks for the information and insights Poof-Daddy.
Eric.
Tempesta
View Profile
Veteran user
USA
398 Posts

Profile of Tempesta
I actually have always gone against the grain with regards to the Mnemonica/Aronson/Memory Arts/Solution approach to memorization--I went old school and had a lot of luck with he Joyal 6-hour memorized deck.

In the Joyal, there's some really good integration between the card and why it is at the position it is at--for instance, the 4S is 4th, and going in multiples and Suited "points", the 4H is at the 8th position--which makes for a pretty simple rules system.

I'm interested in hearing options from people who do stack work and have looked at some of the other approaches out there. For something like this, I'm extremely wary of all the positive reviews that could very well be from first-timers or people who have tried 1 or 2 and gave up.

Is this just rehashing of old ideas--is it just some new, shocking ideas to spark creativity--or is this an alternate approach to formula/rules systems? Improved approach?
//Sean Beard
252life
View Profile
Inner circle
Ninth Circle, Hades
1641 Posts

Profile of 252life
I use Atlas' stack. ("The Solution") It follows a simple logical formula (for me anyway).
When I've had a memory hiccup this system has always gotten me past it.
I've never used Mnemonica, and I'm sure it has advantages I'm unaware of. For my limited card use when performing, I don't see a need to change personally.
Look for all the world like you're counting the brain cells in his cranium.

-Theodore Annemann
Magic1
View Profile
Veteran user
Los Angeles
375 Posts

Profile of Magic1
For me (everyone learns differently) it would have been impossible to learn Mnemonica without this Game: “The Ultimate Mnemonica Trainer” https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/learn-mn......589?mt=8

Sam Gherman (along with being a really great magician and a cool guy) is a fantastic app maker. And now, just a few rounds of this game helps me to refresh the stack (having learned it by playing the game itself). Like Justin Flom, I tried a LOT of methods. I did not find the Trustman book very useful (I guess it was more of a helpful adjunct, but not a solution for me.) Other than actually performing, until you are put under the pressure (that the game provides) of having to name cards and positions quickly, it’s hard to know if you have actually mastered the stack.

I think it’s great that Rick has come up with a new method of learning this difficult skill. But for 9 bucks, I highly recommend having this game to compliment, measure, and refresh your progress. I find it challenging and addictive and there’s even a global level where you get to play against other magicians worldwide.

I probably could not have learned Mnemonica without it.
scott0819
View Profile
Special user
Toronto, Ont.
732 Posts

Profile of scott0819
I learned using Aronson’s approach in ‘A Stack To Remember’ (1979). 52 card images, 52 position images; all based on the phonetic alphabet. You associate the two images with the most vivid, nonsensical, violent or sexual images you can imagine. It sounds like a lot to remember but it provides a built-in failsafe if you ever forget a card.

This sounds similar but Rick does say “no phonetic alphabet” with this system so I’m curious how it differs in approach? Can anyone clarify?
erichoudini
View Profile
Regular user
105 Posts

Profile of erichoudini
I started on Rick's system today and have the first ten cards in the stack. I can see that I will have to review regularly. I like the fact that so far we are working in groups as I have used this type of approach successfully before. I think the teaching is well paced and thorough and I hope to have 10 more cards memorized tomorrow.
Craig333
View Profile
New user
66 Posts

Profile of Craig333
I have Woody aragon's memorandum stack committed to memory, is it confusing to have 2 stacks down?
boinko
View Profile
Elite user
Illinois
410 Posts

Profile of boinko
Quote:
On Mar 11, 2019, scott0819 wrote:

This sounds similar but Rick does say “no phonetic alphabet” with this system so I’m curious how it differs in approach? Can anyone clarify?


Yeah, see my post above. That's the system.
scott0819
View Profile
Special user
Toronto, Ont.
732 Posts

Profile of scott0819
Quote:
On Mar 11, 2019, boinko wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 11, 2019, scott0819 wrote:

This sounds similar but Rick does say “no phonetic alphabet” with this system so I’m curious how it differs in approach? Can anyone clarify?


Yeah, see my post above. That's the system.


Whoops. Thanks, boinko. Super helpful!
I never reworked the Aronson associations for Mnemonica so I may pick this up.
Maxy
View Profile
Elite user
430 Posts

Profile of Maxy
This site is very good for training:
http://www.memorizedeck.com/
MAGIC325
View Profile
Regular user
140 Posts

Profile of MAGIC325
Quote:
On Mar 9, 2019, Tom Cutts wrote:
There is a download, and they will send the flash cards which can help but are not necessary to work the system.

Rick uses a memory system which I used decades ago to memorize the Aronson Stack. I learned it from Kevin Trudeau, and he certainly didn’t invent it.

The foundational system worked amazingly well for me. I have no doubt most people will be stunned how quickly cards fall into place. But there is a catch. If you don’t think like Rick Lax and have his knowledge base of trivial things used to create his version of the system, then you will have to work a little harder in memorizing or in creating your own images. Do you know the top score for an ACT? Do you know your presidents by number? Do you know how many chromosomes in DNA?

Fortunately, most of you will hear one of Rick’s images which doesn’t work for you and you will think, “It should be...” and just like that you are creating your own images and making the system work even better for you.
MAGIC325
View Profile
Regular user
140 Posts

Profile of MAGIC325
Penguin said that there are no flashcards.
Dan McLean
View Profile
Inner circle
Behind you
1230 Posts

Profile of Dan McLean
Quote:
On Mar 11, 2019, MAGIC325 wrote:
Penguin said that there are no flashcards.


Then Penguin needs to watch the video they supplied and produced. Rick Lax says "a sheet with drawings that we have included." About 48 minutes into it.

So where's the sheet?

D
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Mnemonica Trainer by Rick Lax (30 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3~4~5~6~7~8 [Next]
X
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2019 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.19 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL