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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » How to create an irresistable magic offer (7 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Dannydoyle
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WHO CARES?

Do a great show, make it a memorable experience and move on. The self importance involved with being some sort of self appointed "problem solver" is just not needed.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
AndreJ
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Well...probably the guy who's gonna pay you for it...
Want more leads to your magic business? Get a free Lead Generation System at www.gigfunnels.com

Get honest reviews of magic and mentalism at www.gigfunnels.com/reviews/

My background: Loved magic for 25 years, always wanted to do paid gigs but never had the courage. Faced my fears some years ago and now perform regularly. Would love to help you get there too!
Dannydoyle
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Did he Google "problem solver" when he found your magic show? Don't force things on people they are not asking for.

He probably does NOT want that. But you KNOW he wants a magic show. No "probably involved".

Once you start to work in "probably" you are working from YOUR point of view and not that of the client. This is just silly to do.

Again that is "guru speak".
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
AndreJ
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He probably didn't google "memorable experience" either...

He googled "magic show *city* " or "magician *city* "...and that's the easy sale.

The hard one is the guy that google "entertainment wedding *city " ...why should he hire you, the magician, and not "Billy the shadow artist" or "Lisa the acrobat"? He will hire the one who he think will make his event a success. If you want the job, you better explain why a magician is a good choice...not just say "I do a magic show".
Want more leads to your magic business? Get a free Lead Generation System at www.gigfunnels.com

Get honest reviews of magic and mentalism at www.gigfunnels.com/reviews/

My background: Loved magic for 25 years, always wanted to do paid gigs but never had the courage. Faced my fears some years ago and now perform regularly. Would love to help you get there too!
Mindpro
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There's flawed logic with that too. The last way to position yourself is just as I do a magic show. That lumps you in with every other magician. I certainly wouldn't be selling "a magician" or you will just ever be seen as an interchangeable magician.
AndreJ
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Quote:
On Apr 8, 2019, Mindpro wrote:
There's flawed logic with that too. The last way to position yourself is just as I do a magic show. That lumps you in with every other magician. I certainly wouldn't be selling "a magician" or you will just ever be seen as an interchangeable magician.


I agree
Want more leads to your magic business? Get a free Lead Generation System at www.gigfunnels.com

Get honest reviews of magic and mentalism at www.gigfunnels.com/reviews/

My background: Loved magic for 25 years, always wanted to do paid gigs but never had the courage. Faced my fears some years ago and now perform regularly. Would love to help you get there too!
55Hudson
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This seems like an Execution versus Strategy discussion.

Do a great job and business will come to you (Execution)

Target a large, profitable, customer segment with an appropriate value proposition and you will be successful. (Strategy)

Most highly successful businesses do both. You can be successful with only great execution, but you can not be successful with only a great strategy.

Hudson
AndreJ
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Quote:
On Apr 8, 2019, 55Hudson wrote:
This seems like an Execution versus Strategy discussion.

Do a great job and business will come to you (Execution)

Target a large, profitable, customer segment with an appropriate value proposition and you will be successful. (Strategy)

Most highly successful businesses do both. You can be successful with only great execution, but you can not be successful with only a great strategy.


Well put...and looking at your site, you certainly seems to have both.
Want more leads to your magic business? Get a free Lead Generation System at www.gigfunnels.com

Get honest reviews of magic and mentalism at www.gigfunnels.com/reviews/

My background: Loved magic for 25 years, always wanted to do paid gigs but never had the courage. Faced my fears some years ago and now perform regularly. Would love to help you get there too!
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On Apr 8, 2019, 55Hudson wrote:
This seems like an Execution versus Strategy discussion.

Do a great job and business will come to you (Execution)

Target a large, profitable, customer segment with an appropriate value proposition and you will be successful. (Strategy)

Most highly successful businesses do both. You can be successful with only great execution, but you can not be successful with only a great strategy.

Hudson

Oh I have never advocated "if you build it they will come". No no not ever. It is a ridiculous way to do things. The idea of just do a great show and it will be booked is NOT what I am, or have ever advocated.

Selling yourself as some sort of "problem solver" for problems they don't know they have is what I am saying is silly. The two are NOT connected in any way.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
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The whole problem-solver thing is always taken waaay out of context. It is something that gurus use and is more prominent when selling educational products or training (that is NOT what entertainers do). You are selling it to people who are there specifically because of their blocks, barriers, lack of knowledge, and setbacks. Because they don't know something they don't know. They are there because of problems or pain. So of course, targeting your educational and training to assist with such problems makes much more sense in that forum, in that market to those exact types of targeted prospects. Thes era eon no way teh same as entertainment seeking prospects.

The problem (and I see this with so many that believe they need a marketing course, when in fact they need (entertainment) business training, education or course) is that isn't really applicable or adaptable to entertainment. Again, entertainment business is different than conventional or in this case - other specialized business (selling educational solutions to those with actual problems). It is this taking things out of context that both drives me crazy, and hurts both the performer and the industry.

The only thing worse is when performers or entertainers try to take the guru stuff (problem-solving approach) and attempt to repackage it and sell it to performers (we have seen this repeated in this very forum and we all know how that has turned out.) That is actually worse than the gurus - at least they are specializing and know their exact audience, their needs, and how to service them. I do not see this regularly with entertainers.

All people tend to see is "well this guy (the guru) says this, and he seems to be doing well or is successful, but you are not seeing and comparing two actual similar things. The online guru and online marketing/education world is in no way even closely related to selling entertainment or speaking services.
AndreJ
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Can you explain why magicians (and other entertainers) should not be considered "problem solvers". I think you put to much power in the word "problem"...it doesn't need to be heavy pains or barriers. It could be a simple as "I need some good entertainment for my event".

Isn't that a "problem"? Isn't a magic show the solution to that problem?

What is it with this thinking drives you crazy?

I'm simply saying that you should give your customers the value they deserve and need.
Want more leads to your magic business? Get a free Lead Generation System at www.gigfunnels.com

Get honest reviews of magic and mentalism at www.gigfunnels.com/reviews/

My background: Loved magic for 25 years, always wanted to do paid gigs but never had the courage. Faced my fears some years ago and now perform regularly. Would love to help you get there too!
Dannydoyle
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It is guru speak and pointless. I have been on the receiving end of problem solving by entertainers and it sucks.

Now you want to spin it to mean something it doesn't. You want to change it so everyone agrees.

Do what you want, it is your business. But showing up, doing a fantastic job and leaving is the job.

Self aggrandizing with nonsense about problem solving does not suit me.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
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Quote:
On Apr 8, 2019, AndreJ wrote:
Can you explain why magicians (and other entertainers) should not be considered "problem solvers". I think you put to much power in the word "problem"...it doesn't need to be heavy pains or barriers. It could be a simple as "I need some good entertainment for my event".

Isn't that a "problem"? Isn't a magic show the solution to that problem?


Sure. I thought I already had in my previous post above about those seeking guru training and education vs. those seeking entertainment services (one is seeking solutions to problems and pain, the other is not in any way), but I will again.

Prospects seeking entertainment services or information have interests, wants and needs, or...they are simply searching for ideas and possibilities, options. There is no problem or pain at play. Maybe they have specific questions such as "what do you do?" or "What do you charge?" There is no point implanting a problem or pain point just in order and in order so you can be their "solution."

This is not serving their interests or perspectives. By taking the pain/solution approach, you are changing the transaction and relationship dynamics. This is not the best foundation for a business approach to create a truly win-win situation or serve their true interests.

Also, when using this approach we are somehow to believe (as they (the performer) actually believes they can) you can provide "solutions to any pain or problem" they may have. You are their all-encompassing, master cure to all possible pain points or problems. This is ridiculous to assume or expect anyone to believe - especially from a performer.

One of the problems I see with performers is many take or accept bookings they shouldn't be for a variety of reasons. They may not be qualified, or perhaps experienced in the specific type of booking, venue, or market (we see that here all the time - "I just booked a trade show and have never done one before - who can help me with what tricks I should perform...") or they are not at the proper level of proficiency, or they booked it based on lies or untruths about their experience or familiarity with the type of booking, or a host of many other reasons.

However, most of all, the prospect does not have any pain or problems in most entertainment buying situations. They either are looking for options or they have decided on the type of performer they want and are simply looking, shopping and comparing what is available. These are interests and wants, not problems, pain, or whatever you wish to spin to as. It is best to focus solely on their interests and needs and what you offer to serve these - to exceed their expectations. There is nothing worse than when someone calls to either learn more info or to get specific information, only to be led way off course by the performer to their own agenda and interests evading their question and interests in the process. This is not serving the customer. Neither is the pain/solution approach if they clearly are not having pain or problems.

As an agency owner I can tell you the pain I hear the most is when a prospects calls us and says they have contacted 5 or 6 performers and none of them answered their questions, would give them direct or specific answers to their questions or areas of interest, or felt they were being "sold" into something that wasn't what they wanted. I love this when it happens because uninformed and qualified performers actually created pain and frustration that wasn't there and didn't exist when they were contacted, now it has turned them completely against them and they are turning to the professional specialists for a solution - to a problem that never needed to exist! It's crazy!

Time and effort would be much better spent on positioning, branding and market specialization so you separate yourself from, the competition and you can become their only true choice - without the whole problem, pain, solution thing at play at all.

There are many ways to position, present, sell, and book entertainment services without any of the guru nonsense approach. As an entertainment business owner, why would you want to take the lead and advice from an online marketing guru anyhow, let alone position and operate your business as such? There are so many better ways to operate and service your prospects and customers.

And no, a magic show isn't a solution to that problem as much as most magicians would like to think it is.
Dannydoyle
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People call with a need not a problem.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
AndreJ
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have interests, wants and needs,


You call it "interests, wants and needs"...I call it "problems". Same thing in my mind.

But, I thank you for your input. Although I don't agree with all of it, I appreciate the discussion.
Want more leads to your magic business? Get a free Lead Generation System at www.gigfunnels.com

Get honest reviews of magic and mentalism at www.gigfunnels.com/reviews/

My background: Loved magic for 25 years, always wanted to do paid gigs but never had the courage. Faced my fears some years ago and now perform regularly. Would love to help you get there too!
Dannydoyle
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It may be the same in your mind but in the world not even close.

You don't "need solve". It is not even a thing.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
bdungey
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"One fundamental rule in all business is that you should never use price to differentiate yourself from your competitors. If you can’t be the cheapest magician in town, there’s no point in being the second cheapest. Also, you don’t ever want to be the cheapest magician in town."

This is a fundamental problem, generally speaking, with artists selling art. I've been involved in a number of projects where original artistic creations are being sold. We (the artists in question) often have a hard time 'pricing' our products.

It's not too far from being a tradesperson, however, and if you really think about it - it's your expertise that you're selling. The price you come to should be a reflection of the time and spirit you put into your work. It's sometimes hard to put a price on that.

Don't underprice yourself, either. When confronted about your price, you should be able to articulate exactly why you charge what you do.

What do you provide that can't be had from anyone else?

Have you worked on an 'elevator pitch'?

Just some thoughts.
Dannydoyle
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Yes sir. If price is your pitch it is a mistake in my view.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
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Quote:
On Apr 10, 2019, bdungey wrote:
"One fundamental rule in all business is that you should never use price to differentiate yourself from your competitors. If you can’t be the cheapest magician in town, there’s no point in being the second cheapest. Also, you don’t ever want to be the cheapest magician in town."

This is a fundamental problem, generally speaking, with artists selling art. I've been involved in a number of projects where original artistic creations are being sold. We (the artists in question) often have a hard time 'pricing' our products.

...it's your expertise that you're selling. The price you come to should be a reflection of the time and spirit you put into your work. It's sometimes hard to put a price on that. The price you come to should be a reflection of the time and spirit you put into your work. It's sometimes hard to put a price on that.

Don't underprice yourself, either. When confronted about your price, you should be able to articulate exactly why you charge what you do.

What do you provide that can't be had from anyone else?

Have you worked on an 'elevator pitch'?

Just some thoughts.




As far as your pricing thoughts...While I don't ever suggest this, it is an actual business model than some have success with. It doesn't allow you much latitude and the positioning that comes with it may stink, but it is a business model (think Dollartree, .99 stores, or budget retailers). It is so defining and limiting, and it attracts the bottom-end of the market budget customer.

Next, very few magicians are what I would consider "original artistic creations" but I understand your point. In reality though to prospects, they (most) aren't really looking for or concerned with or about "originality" (or 995% of magicians would be out of business). That's not how they shop for entertainment. They have other and different concerns. It's not like painting or comedians where they want and expect original paintings or comedians are seen as a hack if they don't have their own material. Cover bands can be accepted but are always seen and accepted at a certain level or in a certain light.

I think many performers approach pricing the wrong way and therefore make it much more complicated and difficult than it needs to be. Your pricing reflects many things at once including your level of professionalism, your knowledge, and understanding of the performance market, the geographical market, and the needs of your prospects within these areas. I have always used a very simple formula for determining a performers price and it has never failed anyone yet. If anything, it provides much more clarity and direction for them and their business to proceed and succeed.

As far as a performer articulating their price, again this is where value and a few other elements come in. Offering pricing without these is always a formula for problems and disappointment. THIS is what most performers fail to understand and execute properly.

As far as unique offering and having and (truly proper and effective) elevator pitch, this is not the answer to all problems or concerns. Most don't have an effective elevator pitch, and then if they do don't understand how to properly use it effectively (most's are ineffective anyway) and unique material is only as good as how you position, brand or utilize it. None of these are an assurance of getting better pricing unless unerstood and used effectively.
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