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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Console by Mark Lemon / Ellusionist (256 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Lonnie_Lyerla
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On Aug 30, 2019, GeraintClarke wrote:
Quote:
On Aug 29, 2019, The Unmasked Magician wrote:
Hey Pete, thanks for the update. One of the things that bugs me the most is that E won’t show all the reviews that are submitted. It’s been brought up several times in this thread. To me that is just completely outrageous and highly immoral. I cannot trust a company that pretends to allow customers to review their products but then selects which ones are shown and deletes others. What will E do about that?


Hey 'The Unmasked Magician'.

Like Amazon, when a user leaves a review, they have to be a verified buyer. This means that they are logged into their account and our back-end ensures that they DO INDEED have the product before their review is accepted. People can leave reviews as a guest, but they are reviewed manually and often not accepted because they're not owners of the product. They're just leaving bad reviews for fun.

Maybe you don't, but there are a lot of trolls on the internet, who leave bad reviews because they're unwilling to practice, haven't received the items yet or don't like the company or the look of the product. We had 5, 1 star reviews on the 'Deck Of Cards' product 12 hours after it was released. Literally impossible for anyone to have purchased and received it in that time.

This has a detrimental effect on the artist, as they get paid royalties for sales. If someone leaves a review "Just watched the download, haven't received the item yet as I ordered today, but I don't think I like the look of this. 2 stars" then we simply can't accept that.

It's like reviewing a movie from the trailer. You have to have the complete package in front of you.

Reviews are also automatically not approved for massive use of profanity, or manually not approved for exposure.

eg. "I just got this trick. It's a flap. Save your money, because you can make this yourself for $2 if you go to staples and grab X"

Some reviewers are reviewing the SECRET, which is a big issue with selling magic. We aren't selling the secret, we're selling what you can achieve to a lay audience using that secret. Some people don't get that and it's not a fair representation of the hard work either we or the artist put into their original offering.

EXAMPLE:

Here is the kind of review we get. This is from the mystery deck product on our secret menu. Guest reviewer (not logged in)

"The bicycle 1800 deck..... Are you kidding me??????? No slow selling, dead stock decks? Only rare and unreleased decks? I am willing to bet you my life savings you havnt sent anyone an "unreleased" deck that ordered this. Just pathetic." - James

This was left as a review. However the customer was massively mistaken. The Bicycle 1900 deck that was sent out, was completely NEW, not released and a drastically different tuck, back design (for legal reasons) and faces compared to the old 1800 design. Hence the change of name too.

Here's another on Console specifically from 3 days ago..... "1 STAR. Paid $150 for this trick with no instructions. Just sent me the gimmick. Form emails were sent back when I contacted the company." - Daniel (last name begins with L, but I won't give that here)

====== This is the level of misinformation that's spread online. That can't be an approved review on our website. For our sake and Mark's.

Console instructions are placed in the users account automatically upon purchase (when the items are in stock, which they are.) We also have it printed IN THE BOX which goes to this link : https://www.ellusionist.com/console-instructions

The page says this" If you purchased your console device from Ellusionist, then you already have the instructions that you need in order to learn and use this amazing piece of magic.

To view your videos, simply log into your account then go to the MY DOWNLOADS section. There you will see the videos available for you to view.

If you purchased the App by itself from the app store, you can still perform the incredible Lottery Routine taught HERE on Magic Stream. Please consider purchasing the Console device to truly unlock the power of our creation.

If you believe you should have access to the full download, or the app please contact customer service with your order number and issue and we'll do our best to help you as quickly as we can."

The form email he was 'sent' is an auto-responder to say we've received his query and will get back to him within 48 hours.

Can you see where we were unable to approve all reviews? It's not that we're trying to hide anything... there's actually a 3 star review on the product page from a buyer.

"Nice idea, good app but unfortunately no € currency design for the lottery prediction. What a pity for customers from europe" - Ben (3 stars)

He dropped it by 2 whole stars for not being able to do it in Euros. We still approved it. It was true, he bought it, it didn't expose the method etc. I disagree with him, but he's allowed to leave that review (and it was approved) because that's his opinion.

Hopefully that shines more light on the review process and how we try to keep it fair.


===================
REFUNDS AND RETURNS
===================

To address this also, we've only had 18 returned units. This is just over 2%. - Less than the industry average for electronic goods.

The magic Café is an echo chamber. The same people post over and over again about the same issues. It's easy to assume here that people are outraged. But overall, the truth is, they're not.

"Ellusionist is just faking that number."

It's not faked. 13 IOS refunds. 5 Android ones. I logged in and checked..... When people actually contact us officially, we're happy to replace defective units. However, upon US testing those defective units, a significant number of them turned out to be user error. Or the app wasn't functioning on their Apple 3GS phone from 2009. (Even Apple doesn't support this phone now.)



=======================
WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE
=======================

Button presses seem to be a big issue and we are listening. I've just booked a train ticket for Pete to travel down to Mark's house in London. He's going to film an additional tuition video about troubleshooting problems with Console.

This should help users to either fix the way they're using the device, so it's perfect. Or to establish that it IS one of the rare defective units. Either from manufacturing error, or accidental damage in transit / by the user.

I wrote a blog on this, some people think it's fun to hate on a big, faceless company, but the 12 members of staff that work here are all people. We take days off, we have vacations (especially those with kids over summer) and we take breaks from NON-official work entities like social media & forums. (It's healthy to do so)

I remember earlier on in this thread when someone left a disingenuous comment about how I didn't get back to them.

I responded in just over 24 hours on a bank holiday Monday. (Memorial day) and they messaged me the day before (on a Sunday) and expected a response immediately. I don't work Sunday's.

When I didn't answer them on that Sunday, their immediate thought was to spread mis-information on this forum about our bad customer service or my 'lack of response'.

Context really matters and they'll be some people that will find any reason to specifically hate one person or one company. Regardless of the truth.

I've also viewed a lot of comments regarding the lack of case on this. In fact this 5 star review was left on our page yesterday from a buyer.

"Just received this in the mail a couple of days ago and I've already got it down and working great. This is probably the best effect I've bought in at least a few years. The remote and the app both work very well and are easy to use. I also just received the Poloroid printer today and it works great. Can't wait to use this with the printer and a card to wallet! Other people were talking about how the console device has no case with exposed components. I figured out a quick fix for this. I used a tiny 1.5X3 ziplock baggy and made it just a little bit longer by taping the end of another bag on the end of it and now it is the perfect size to hold the console device. Now I'm not scared of it braking from water damage or moist hands. Yes it should have been made with a case but I'm not complaining because this is such a great effect and is easy to do and everything works beautifully. There were a couple bugs in the app when I first received this. I emailed the support team and the developer of the app was very quick to address these issues and get them fixed the day after I reported this. I would like to thank the E team for having such awesome customer service. Overall this is one of the best purchases I've bought from Ellusionist. Highly Recommended!!!" - Jamie Day. (5 stars)

This has been addressed by Mark, but we're going to include it in the download. All Console devices have been specially coated so that contact points won't be affected by sweaty or moist hands. It's completely safe to use, without a casing.

Hope that helps and we're here to answer any questions. But it's impossible to do a full-time job, travel around the world to conventions, make time for family and respond to every single person/post on this thread. That's why we have support@ellusionist.com as an official channel. EVERYTHING sent there get's answered / read.

I know this new troubleshooting video from Mark & Pete will really help to answer any other queries and that's our top priority for next week.

Have a great weekend guys & gals,

- G




Well, I’m not a verified buyer yet though Ellusionist. I bought my device from Mark personally. But yet my review is on the site. Which was a positive one at that time. Of course this next part is just my opinion. When you mentioned Incase someone were to get a “RARE” defective product, well it appears that in the fb group and the Café are mostly people who have purchased the “rare” defective product. Doesn’t sound so rare in my opinion. Sorry for not word by wording it.
As one of many customers who have made several complaints and recommendations on the product ( including the app ) after purchasing it, it does not look or feel like any of our criticism or recommendations have been taken into account. And if silence is accountability, then I’d make another recommendation to have someone speak more often to us purchasers about the products issues we’ve addressed.

And Mr Turner, what a great addition to the team you will be my friend. I appreciate you taking some time and touching up in this subject. I understand that we on the outside of those meetings don’t know the context. Or have any knowledge of the directions E. plans on taking. Regardless, you’re a real gift to magic. And I hope to observably see the differences and changes that’s scheduled to take place.
The Mysterious One
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On Sep 5, 2019, Lonnie_Lyerla wrote:

Well, I’m not a verified buyer yet though Ellusionist. I bought my device from Mark personally. But yet my review is on the site. Which was a positive one at that time. Of course this next part is just my opinion. When you mentioned Incase someone were to get a “RARE” defective product, well it appears that in the fb group and the Café are mostly people who have purchased the “rare” defective product. Doesn’t sound so rare in my opinion. Sorry for not word by wording it.
As one of many customers who have made several complaints and recommendations on the product ( including the app ) after purchasing it, it does not look or feel like any of our criticism or recommendations have been taken into account. And if silence is accountability, then I’d make another recommendation to have someone speak more often to us purchasers about the products issues we’ve addressed.

And Mr Turner, what a great addition to the team you will be my friend. I appreciate you taking some time and touching up in this subject. I understand that we on the outside of those meetings don’t know the context. Or have any knowledge of the directions E. plans on taking. Regardless, you’re a real gift to magic. And I hope to observably see the differences and changes that’s scheduled to take place.


Eloquently put Lonnie. If you are reading these posts Geraint or Peter (or anyone else from E), please keep in mind that this comment is from a magician that "went to bat" about this product, showed excitement, and later tremendous patience and restraint. In reading his posts, he REALLY wanted the Console app and device to work as advertised. Once again, I have never seen a group think mentality here at the Café where people return a product because others here pressured someone online and I have been here for 14 years. I have never seen that in the private Facebook groups I belong to for products and books I have purchased as well. I constantly see FOMO here, but not the fear of people's opinions for owning a product already purchased.

If there is someone you can conduct a lessons learned session with to discuss the customer experience vs. product related issues, Lonnie is your man!
pegasus
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On Sep 5, 2019, The Unmasked Magician wrote:
Ah, ok. Keep me posted, please. Perhaps I can arrange smth. Meanwhile, make sure once you’re here you load up on food and clothes and other stuff that you won’t have anymore after the Brexit.


Haha. It’s you that should be concerned.
The Unmasked Magician
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I have to admit I’m a little worried that me and other Europeans will be charged extra at Blackpool this year. Smile
Please check regularly if you are becoming the type of magician Jerry Seinfeld jokes about.
dave_matkin
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On Sep 6, 2019, The Unmasked Magician wrote:
I have to admit I’m a little worried that me and other Europeans will be charged extra at Blackpool this year. Smile


Really??!!!!!

I wouldn't worry if I were you ..... You may not even be allowed in the country lol Smile

You could try sneaking in through the doorstop though I suppose
dave_matkin
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Whoops auto incorrect at work - it should be backstop, not doorstop.
The Unmasked Magician
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If anyone tries to stop me at the border ... I will show them FU2. Smile
Please check regularly if you are becoming the type of magician Jerry Seinfeld jokes about.
dave_matkin
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On May 24, 2019, Ramon M wrote:
I recently had some bad experience with Ellusionist, package getting lost, unclear communication, months of needing to write to them over and over again asking what is wrong.
Finally I cancelled the order, they payed me back, but of course not shipping costs, etc.
Because of that I will not buy from them anymore, at least not anything that has to be shipped to Europe.
I like some of their products, so it's a pity, but the trust is gone.
Which is pretty important when buying something which is already often partly unclear to begin with.


I know that the discussion has moved on.... however if there are Ellusonist items you like the look of check-in with PropDog - as they sell a bunch of the Eliusonsist items.
The Mysterious One
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Propdog is really good. I received my order pretty quickly (in about 2 weeks time if memory serves me right.) That is really quick considering the items were shipped to Texas from the UK and go through customs.
MR Effecto
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I never had any issues with Ellusionist.
The Unmasked Magician
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Ah. A unicorn. Smile
Please check regularly if you are becoming the type of magician Jerry Seinfeld jokes about.
Peter_turner
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The videos are shot and edited Smile

I just need to get them sent over to Ellusionist now! It was eye opening for me Smile great device I jammed with Mark and added a few ideas Smile

Pete x
dooblehorn
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On Sep 6, 2019, The Mysterious One wrote:
Propdog is really good. I received my order pretty quickly (in about 2 weeks time if memory serves me right.) That is really quick considering the items were shipped to Texas from the UK and go through customs.


Yes, I agree always great and fast service from Propdog!!
GeraintClarke
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Hey all,

Here is the additional video and explanations, as promised : https://magicstream.com/programs/console......e-turner

Cheers,

- G
lunatik
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I would post this downstairs as this is open to the general public unless nothing is being revealed Smile
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mantel
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On Sep 24, 2019, GeraintClarke wrote:
Hey all,

Here is the additional video and explanations, as promised : https://magicstream.com/programs/console......e-turner

Cheers,

- G


Geraint Clarke, why does Ellusionist keep posting explanations that even those without magicstream accounts can access?
ArtIn
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It’s called marketing I guess...
mantel
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On Sep 24, 2019, ArtIn wrote:
It’s called marketing I guess...


Right... Even the original explanation for the FU Deck was available for everyone until I pointed it out.
dooblehorn
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On Sep 24, 2019, GeraintClarke wrote:
Hey all,

Here is the additional video and explanations, as promised : https://magicstream.com/programs/console......e-turner

Cheers,

- G

Pete and Mark, thanks for these videos...They are great and the extra explanation in detail is appreciated.
kissdadookie
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On Sep 24, 2019, mantel wrote:
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On Sep 24, 2019, ArtIn wrote:
It’s called marketing I guess...


Right... Even the original explanation for the FU Deck was available for everyone until I pointed it out.


That was a bad move. The Console explanation though, I think in this case it makes sense because it really has helped a lot in essentially laying it out for me so that I can make an informed decision (actually, very tempted to pick this up, I was honestly put off by the release due to the negative feedback in this thread and my own bias against mushy buttons seemingly being validated by the reports of the buttons not working well Smile ).
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