Hi everyone,

Interested in hearing how your business developed as a magician during the first few years or so. I think this would benefit a lot to read.

How you started, how it grew, how long before you could go ful-time, any big aha's, etc.

Concise answers like this might help other budding magiacians (myself included). For example:

Year One: Started with a birthday party here and there. Mostly sent out neighborhood flyers but not consistently. By end of year I had about one birthday party a weekend.

Year Two: Started getting a couple referals in the beginning and six months in had three birthday parties a week. Sent out some sales letters (got some help in Café) to daycares and got a couple jobs doing that per month. By end of year I quit my full-time job and though it was hard I managed to make bills.

Year Three: Started making much more money! Everything starting to gel. Maybe five birthday parties a week and six daycares a month. I think the reason everything improved is that I started doing more self-promotion during birthdays, like coloring pics, after party follow-ups with parents, etc.

Looking forward to reading experiences,
Tod

p.s. Above examples are hypothetical only and not based on anyone.

Tod,

Great question...unfortunately, the answer took over 500 pages in my Success in Magic course!

As I explained in the course, it took about five years to get my business to the point where it was full-time with 150-200 bookinga a year. Then another five years gaining crucial experience in many different markets as I discovered my strengths and built the business it to a level where it could support my entire family (with a stay at home wife!)

I'm sure you can cut years off that learning curve if you have a clear vision combined with workable strategies AND take concrete action. That's what my course is all about.

The biggest "aha" for me is in Chapter Nine of Volume One, where I detail the career ladder for magicians - both children's performers and performers for adults. It's the secret for making the jump to the big time.

You can make a good living as a small time operator - I know that from experience - but if you want to make the jump to the "big time" you need to know what separates the (with apologies to the women reading) "men from the boys." Sorry, you will have to invest in the course to learn that one.

jim

PS: Your hypothetical example is not too far off the mark.

Persistence, clear focus on what you desire out of your magic, obsession and the priority to make it so, financial planning, speaking skills, creativity, resilience, resourcefulness and a positive attitude.

There you have it! Once you have mastered and made each of these tools a part of your mental kit then, you will be on your path to success!~ The rest will follow!

There is no secret in anyone's individual path which will lead you to yours! It's as simple as that and that is what no one ever listens to!

It wasn't until I managed to make each of the above principals a part of my life in a sincere and dedicated way that, doors started opening for me.

The confidence of the successive victories establishes in yourself a congruency in your demeanor, image, and presentations. This helps to give one's act the polished look which, sets you apart from the rest.

We spend the first part of our lives wanting and acquiring! The second part (if you are fortunate enough to awaken) you spend in a giving and helping mode. That is the definintion of success!~

It may sound a bit esoteric but, once you make giving and helping others, the focus of your life then the rewards for yourself appear on their own~!

May you have the best of fortunes on you journey?
r2

Well said, ReyRey!

That's great ReyRey, but that wasn't my question

As an instructor, I could list the same qualites towards becoming an expert cave diver.

But I could also tell you some specifics during the first few years that would give "legs" to some of that.

And it was that which my question was aimed towards.

Regards,
Tod

Tgunther,

Rey Rey and Jim Snack, did answer your question in detail. There is no set method for all. Some people are good salesmen and some are not. Some can do a show and get 10 more shows from that one.

Everyone, is different to your personality and city, town, or part of the county you live in.

I will state if you want to do birthday parties, persue that. If you want to be a Las Vegas performer, persue that. If you want to do banquets, persue that.

Stay focused on what you want and only work on that goal.

Rarely a kiddies birthday show performer will lead to a Las Vegas review profession. Not saying it cannot happen, but your chances are much less.

So much depends on your abilities and how creative you are in possessing a unique personality. Do you have a magic act noone else in the World has. i.e. Mr. Electric, Greg Frewin, Johnny Thompson, etc.

Lance Burton, it was his stage persona more then his magic that set him on his star path to be a Las Vegas performer.

You first need a unique commercial act. Then you must be able to do that act in your sleep. Then you must promote that act to the market it is geared toward. Then you must produce the results you claimed you could deliever.

Then there is the other angle. Paul Diamond and others say to do any shows you can for anyone anywhere for any amount. Just keep working. Experience as much as you can.

Your original post was a very good plan; the only thing wrong with it, is you did not say what your end goal was you are trying to accomplish. We need more info for more detailed answers. As vague questions, get vague answers. You did not even want to show where in the world you live. If you live in the middle of the desert, then I would say you have to move to an area where there are people to present shows for.

Please do not get upset with those trying to help, when you are not willing to expose yourself to answer those questions.

I will ask you to go over the previous 2 post from very kind gentlemen that tried to help you. The basically have said the same thing I just said.

"Goal + Vision + Action = Success"

Wm,

My post was not a plan, but a question.

Describe the first few years of your experience, preferably in the format I gave. Pretty simple.

So far all I'm getting is esoterical answers though

Which do have merit too, but unfortuantely it wasn't what I asked about.

Personally, I think everyone is just afraid the taxman might be watching.

Best,
Tod

Tod....here is our story, as exciting or dull as it may be.

I did magic for fun as a kid, actually even did a library show at our school. At about age 12 ditched the magic for sports. Jump ahead about 16 years to 1997... A company hires me to come to Indianapolis to do sales for them. I meet my future wife Kristen Johnson, who grew up with magic, clowning, etc. Her mother Sunny Johnson has been in the business for about 20 years, been featured on cover of Linking Ring and owns an entertainment company.

After 6 months in Indy I go to my first magic convention, Abbott's Get Together. After that weekend I come home on Monday and quit my job, deciding I know what I am gonna do with my life. I'm gonna be a magician...lol

Well without a job I MUST make this work. I know sales and marketing, so I put that to work. I am also lucky that I already have a great in with an entertainment company. Sunny Johnson teaches me clowning, magic and balloons. My first gig was as a clown at a Meijer store opening. Next I work on a simple routine and balloons and start doing birthday parties for $65. Sunny is able to give me 2-4 shows a weekend. To wrap up year one, I do ballons at a restaurant weekly and still doing b-day parties 2-4 times a week.

Year two I am still doing clown shows, but working on my routine as a magician. I start to do some strolling gigs here and there and know that now I want to do magic only and work towards that.

Year three Kristen,(currently doing clown gigs) and I start working on a magic show together. That summer we perform at a music festival with a 25 minute stage act, consisiting of a friend's borrowed base, some stand up, straight jacket and Kevin James Snow Animator. In the mean time we have developed a side business working with all the pro sports teams in Indy. It wasnt doing magic, but it did allow us to make great contacts. To this day that is still the best thing we ever did. It put us out on the road early and we learned the ropes of life on the road. We have had a Motorhome for a year now. Near the end of the year we take a 6 month hiatus in the mountains of New Mexico. It is there that we laid the groundwork for what we wanted our show to be. We came up with the name, tons of goals and stared scripting the routine. We buy our first big illusion, Twister, which happened to be the first one ever built. We also purchase Stargate production. Both of these being used illusions. I have started to work at the famous Illusions restaurant, doing tableside magic and leading up to doing a stage show.

Year 4, due to contacts we made with our other business, we have been invited to perform at the Summer Olympics in Sydney, Australia. We will be doing mostly streeet magic and some escapes. We are there for 8 weeks touring around Australia. Just before going there I propose to Kristen and we get married in Autralia, barefoot on the beach. Before we left for Australia, we went to Branson, MO saw and met Kirby Van Birch. It was there that we really learned how important it was to have quality and authorized illuions. At that time, we commision John Gaughan to build an Origami for us, and Magic makers to build us an Asrah and The Spike Escape. Upon out return to the states we get all our new illusions and start rehearsing. We hear through the grapevine that there is a TV show being produced about Houdini and escape artists. With Kristen doing escapes, I pitch the idea of a female escape artist to the production company producing the show for The Travel Channel. They came out to our buddy's studio and Kristen does the Spike Escape for them. They love it and want footage of it. The entire show was made up mostly existing footage. Well, we didn't have footage of the spikes yet. But, we did have our first ever full evening show coming up just a month later. So, I sell them on coming to our show and shooting it live. I also sell them on shooting the entire show with 3 cameras, one on a 30 foot jib arm and that we retain all rights to the footage. I hvae now just secured for free, a $30,000 video shoot. The night of the show comes, the theatre has just over 800 people in it. This is our first full show, our first public, ticketed performance and we get great footage of the whole show. One month later we retire the motorhome and buy a Freightliner semi truck with a condo sleeper cab. We had also purchased a large sound system, big enough for 2,000 people.

Year five...Once again use contacts made, we launch on our first tour. It is as the opening act with a speaker and a rapper. In February we set out on the Music To Die For U.S. Tour. We do 23 different cities in 23 days. It was a whirlwind, but it was awesome. The new truck is great and is paying for itself. We are doing a lot of fundraiser type of shows. It is working well for us and both our marketing skills are paying off. We really watch the bottom line of expenses. We are able to produce the and market it to the oublic for lower than most in our opinion. We start buying posters, flyers in bulk, thus bringing the price way down. For less than $60 we promote a show with 75 full color posters, 1,000 full color flyers, professional tickets, press releases, 60 second radio spots, and 90 second commercial for the show. We have now hired a prodution manager full time to run all of our sound, video, special effects, etc.

Inside The Houdini Museum airs on The Travel Channel 9 times. We are on the road up to 8 months out of the year now.

Year 6, the show is getting bigger, we are getting more bookings, word of mouth is paying off huge. We are just plugging away trying to do the best we can. The shows are going well, average attendance at shows is around 400. We are doing almost 95% repeat bookings every year. We still do some corporate work, but most of our time is filled with our full show. Kristen unveils the first ever full view Water Torture Cell. She is also the only female in the U.S. attempting this feat. It is unveiled at the First Escape Artist Convention. We tour the country with the Water Torture Cell as the finale in our show.

Year 7, what's left of it. We have now added a full Intelligent light rig to the show. We can now turn even a warehouse into a theatre. We are now really focusing on taking our show to the next level. Trying to refine everything, work on choreoraphy, polish the entire show. This year seems to be our best yet. We are headlining several stages at music fectivals around the country and hope to do much much more.


Sorry for such a long post, the bottom line is we just went for it from day one. We knew what we wanted and didn't let anything or anyone stop us. All along the way, big names in the business would tell us "oh, that's really hard what you are tryijg to do". "oh that's too much work". Well it's what we want to do...and quite honestly, when you do something you love, it really isn't work. We have also been blessed to have some great people in the business to help us along the way.

Best of luck to you, hope in some way this helps.

Kevin & Kristen
Living Illusions

Terrific post, Kevin!

Tod,

Hearing an inspiring story of how one person did it can motivate some people to just go out there and take action. However, many need more details of "how to make it happen."

Jim Snack hinted at the fact that his course teaches you all you need to know to grow your business. It teaches you practical ways to do goal setting, and achieve astonishing growth over a period of 5 years, doubling your growth every year.

If this is what you are looking for, the nuts and bolts of how to do it, you might want to invest in his course.

This is not to downplay Kevin's great post. Like I said, to hear his inspiring story may be enough to motivate some. Some others might need more. It is just not practical on a forum to go into too many details, covering such as big topic as "the first 5 years." Jim said it took him hundreds of pages within his course.

- Donald.

Great story, Kevin! As a former stage manager who once toured Europe with 55 people and two tons of equipment, my hat's off to you.

There are many valuable pieces of advice in your post. Any one who aspires to tour with illusions should re-read it several times.

Better yet, why don't you expand this post into an article, or even a book. Just keep documenting how your business is developing. You are doing it the way it should be done.

I hope to see your show someday.

Kevin,

This is EXACTLY what I was looking for. Thanks!

Were that more magicians as thoughtful and helpful.

Your posting was inspirational and gave legs to all the theory.

I'm sure many will be bookmarking it for the future.

If I could encapsule your words, it seems these attributes have led most to your success:

1. Forming contacts through networking (can't be overstated enough how much help comes from this)
2. Not listening to naysayers
3. Constantly trying to cut expenses
4. Keep on refining your routine over time
5. Small beginnings grow large inch by inch (from clown noses to international illusions)
6. The importance of sales/marketing skills
7. Rebookings are the biggest part of your business
8. Offering fundraisers has been a major strategic plank of success
9. Kristin is the most important person in your life!

Anything else you'd like to add here, Kevin?

I hope others will share some of their beginnings on this post also.

I think they go far in giving "legs" to much of the advice many give.

God bless,
Tod

Tod...Glad I could be of some help or inspiration. I'll touch on each of your points below.

1. Yes, forming contacts is the best thing to do. Our other business is not magic but entertainment related. This puts us in contact with performers, agents, event planners, etc. I highly recommend surrounding yourself with people that can help make things happen for you.

2. staying away from negative people, especially those that really have never done what we are doing. Now that doesn't mean staying away from construcive criticism.

3. Cutting expenses..maybe better put, figuring our how to do the highest quality work, but keeping more money in my pocket. By doing things in bulk, we save tons on expenses. For instance we buy posters at a minimum of 5,000 at a time. For flyers it even more at 20,000 at a time. We license ticketing software and have great looking tickets. We do professional radio spots in house as well as video and music editing. Now that takes time...time to learn all the different software, tips, etc. But the end product is we can not just send out an agent friendly DVD, but one that is custom tailored for that agent, with his info right in the video. To do that takes about 1 minute of time to change a text box.

4. always strive to get better. Right now we are at a point in time where we can not take the show any further without outside assistance. We are looking for a director and choreographer to help in the areas where we have done our best, but it needs to be better.

5. Grow small, but be driven towards your goal and get there the most direct way possible. Skip left and right turns and move forward. There will be bumps; that's what shock absorbers are for...LOL

6 Many have said it before....show business is 90% business. Market yourself well and you are light years ahead of most.

7. Rebookings...Anyone can book a show once; a good performer can go back again.

Selling yourself...when we get hired to do our show. We don't look at it as being paid to perform....we are being paid to advertise ourselves. Someone paid us to go out before an audience of which there will be someone in the crowd that can use our services. I believe Steve Hart just released a newsletter that talks about booking 2-3 shows from every show you do. We can honestly say that we are close to 100% of booking a show from every show we do...now not 2-3 like Hart suggest, but we'll get better.

8. A good friend came to us one day while at Magi fest a few years back. He took us to dinner and laid out a plan for us. It was based on fundraisers. He felt highly of us and wanted to see us succeed. I had never heard of Kaplan or any of the other people that have done fundraising shows. He said if we get people what they need, we just may get what we need. That night, sitting at Waffle House, we learned what we needed to go out and try this idea. That was February. Three months later in May we did our first ever full evening show, a fundraiser for a football team. We had sold just over 800 tickets...not too bad for oue first time. We are forever thankful to Peter White for pointing us in the right direction.

9. Kristen is the person God has blessed me with to share my life with. I am very lucky to have her as my wife, my partner in our show, as well as my best friend.

Anything else I would like to add?...come on, of course, can't you see I like talking...LOL

Honestly, I hope whatever your dreams may be that you strive for and reach them.

All our best,
Kevin & Kristen

Wow! tgunther, great topic.

Kevin, thank you for sharing. I almost gave up on this thread until I read your post.

Fantastic and truly inspirational, hopefully more succesful magicians will post their stories as well.

Kevin, thank you so much for sharing your story with us. Knowing what you went through made it real for me. People are where they are because of the choices they make.

When I see someone who is successful in what they do and others who are struggling, I know that they each did something differently to get to where they are. And many times I only wish I could hear their tales. It not only helps motivate me, but it teaches me lessons. It shows me what things I can do to succeed and what things I shouldn't do.

I've saved your story to refer to for inspiration. Being a full time illusionist may not be my ultimate goal, but it helps me to see that someone made it work.

I think I will also get a copy of Jim Snacks system. I must invest in my success. Thank you Tod for this topic.

What a great thread... glad I stopped and browsed. Awesome story Kevin. Gives me the push I need to keep believing I can get there.

Martin

You ask a question and you get a real answer. Can't get much better than that. Excellent Kevin. Great thread.

Tom

Any other takers out there?

I would love to hear from the other branches of magic like Close up and Mentalism.

I know there must be more than a few restaurant, cruise ship, and corporate enetertainers out there with some great input.

Let's hear it guys...

I think too many magicians are worried the taxman might be watching for anyone to honestly recount their careers. With Kevin we got lucky. Just a guess.

Tod

IMHO I don't believe its fear of the tax man. Maybe the reason you're not getting a lot of answers is "just because."

Kevin's story and advice is clear and from the heart. So, apparently is the magic he makes as a team with Kristen. Kevin's post also kept everything on the positive hope-filled side of things. Decide your goal. Be Proactive and DO your goal. Keep refining/ coming up with new goals.

I perform magic simply out of love for doing it. I have had a life long fascination and have performed on and off sice I was 14 (almost 30 years ago) It recently helped to keep me positive when I was not working full time.

Would I like to perform as a full time professional magician? Sure, but that is not where my personal goals are right now. Maybe one day. But for now I work with a Party Store and I do a small bit of self promotion. I'll gladly do a benefit or fundraiser for a needy group at the drop of a hat. I send out a follow up letter to the party host and hope for a reply. Not everyone responds and I think it is for the same reason as I said before, "just because." They have their reasons and its not in their priorities right now.

Maybe a good question to ask yourself is "Do I know anyone who can mentor me?" If not, what do I need to do to find someone?" Maybe you could get active in your local SAM or IBM; maybe even someone on the board would assist by e-mail or pm. Just a thought.

In all, best of luck and keep a positive outlook on your goal plan!

Best regards,

Vinny

Tod, some pretty long replies here so I'll try and be as brief as possible (famous last words). I was a professional musician way back in the 70s. I worked at various venues with children's entertainers and couldn't help noticing the tremendous feedback from children. I couldn't help noticing these guys were working shorter hours and earning more than me too! Started doing shows just during the wintertime in 1978/79. September 1980 went for it full-time with my new wife, Sue. We quite frankly had a run-away success that we still cannot believe to this day. We did practically put our 'last penny' into it though. Always bought quality, visual props. Started investing in very intricate hand-made marionettes with working jaws, eyes etc. Started organising games with kids and did a 'mini' sort of disco.

So all the infrastructure was there.

Stormed straight into Yellow Pages with a substantial ad. Also used newspapers at the time. Went for the areas and established markets we knew other entertainers were working, - one in particular being a large affluent Jewish area (even though we are not Jewish). We listened to what people said about other entertainers, both the positive and the negative. I'll be honest and say we did go for the "jugular" of many other local entertainers in the party market. Whatever they did, - we'd elaborate on it!

We REALLY were into the hundreds of parties almost straight away in 1981 (albeit the party atmosphere of the Charles and Diana wedding helped here in the UK Summer 1981).

Went on to travel thousands of miles touring with 30 minute marionette cabaret - although on reflection this was just to satisfy a 'showbiz' desire, and of no significant financial benefit. All through the 80s business simply stormed. 1990s - declines in business, different trends, less weekday parties. Started playing piano/organ in clubs again 3 nights a week to compensate (for two years). 1994 we both started working separately from each other. Then to present day we are simply quids (dollars) in, because we can be in TWO PLACES AT ONCE! Happy to just work three days a week now (apart from Christmas). I keep mentioning money - and someone will try and pull me up on this, so yes, of course you have to have an aptitude for kids' entertaining, and not just an aptitude for making money. Thankfully we have both. Never done adult magical entertaining - never needed to, and have still managed to buy considerable property (real estate), contribute to personal pensions and have good holidays. No fear on this posting from Her Majesty's Inland Revenue (the taxman to you and me!). Always kept accurate, clear, concise accounts with a top firm of Accountants since 1974!!

Someone mentioned 'mentors'. You are very lucky indeed if you can find a WILLING mentor, believe me! (well that was our experience).