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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Contact Mind Reading recommedations (3 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

aks
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Hello,

I've been doing some research on CMR recently and just wondering recommendations on the best place to start.
I'm aware of Satori and Osterlind's publications. Does anyone have any other recommendations or, which would be a better place to start.

Thanks
Goldfield
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Universe
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It takes years to learn this & what you are already aware of is all you need.
The day science begins to study non-physical phenomena, it will make more progress in one decade than in all the previous centuries of its existence. Nikola Tesla, Serbian Inventor
WitchDocChris
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Learning the skill is easy. Getting good at it takes time. Back when Washington Irving Bishop was making his living with CMR one of the issues of his act was that people would go home and try it - and it would work for them.

The most comprehensive source I've read was Full Contact Mind Reading by Jerome Finley. It has some nuances that I haven't seen in other sources. But if I'm being totally honest - you don't actually need them.

You already know enough if you've read anything on it. Just start trying it. Start small, build up.
Christopher
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Psycho Seance book: https://tinyurl.com/y873bbr4
Slim King
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Try pennies in the corners of a room … Work up from there... Smile
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
funsway
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old things in new ways - new things in old ways
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I have performed Helstomism for 60 years, having learned it from Arnold Furst. So, three thoughts to add to the advice above.

1) audience selection/rejection is critical. This is not a "for every situation demonstration" or ever "on demand."

2) the essential skills of empathy, presence and interpersonal engagement are best learned elsewhere than the magic community, i.e.
look to speech training, acting, social work, meditation and such with no thought of entertain people. Never from a video. Why?
Trust is an essential element and that cannot be based on copying anyone else. Yet, just "getting out and doing" it in the wrong setting might develop the wrong focus.

3) the ultimate demonstration is when you can drop the assistant's hand (break the physical connection) and carry on to successful completion alone. This requires a level of confidence
and "putting yourself at risk" higher than most folks are willing to work for. I have achieved this level in more than half of my performances because I will not present/engage
unless the entire audience is supportive of the effort - an hour of uninterrupted group involvement with the expectation of participating in a demonstration of extraordinary Innate
ability.

Just my opinions, of course ...

All this to get you to ask self, "Why am I pursuing this activity?" "What is my expected result?" "How do I create the conditions for success?"

You, you can do CMR as a stunt or pretend mentalism. Why? - when you can do the real thing?
When I perform magic I am an entertainer. When I do CMR I am an orchestrator of a profound experience that hovers between science and mysticism.

I mostly agree with what Chris says - except , there is no "Try" - just "Do."
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



ShareBooks at www.eversway.com * questions at funsway@eversway.com
Slim King
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I would also suggest watching a real pro doing it live. I watched Kreskin do it and gleened half a dozen things I'd never have understood by just reading about it.
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
ipe
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Quote:
On Oct 3, 2019, aks wrote:
Hello,

I've been doing some research on CMR recently and just wondering recommendations on the best place to start.
I'm aware of Satori and Osterlind's publications. Does anyone have any other recommendations or, which would be a better place to start.

Thanks

Better place to start? Maybe Banachek's Psi Series Banachek #3.
What would a real mindreader do?
mindmagic
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Stanton Carlisle's book Master Mentality is useful.

Barry
WitchDocChris
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The first book I read was Full Contact Mind Reading. The second was Psychophysiological Thought Reading.

As far as the method - they both cover it perfectly well. FCMR has a more nuanced explanation of how to create the optimal situation for success, and has more routine suggestions.

I think the biggest hurdle to overcome is that it's not as difficult as it seems it should be. With very little practice I've been able to locate random objects (I like to use it with a pool table - they pick a ball and I tell them which one it is), duplicate (simple) drawings, and do a seemingly method-free which hand.

Though if the history of the Café is anything to go on, the OP has already bounced.
Christopher
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Psycho Seance book: https://tinyurl.com/y873bbr4
ipe
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Christopher,
I love CMR too. And, as you said, it is much easier than what people generally think. I'm thinking to rewrite the methods to most of my effects with CMR for some weeks now.

Quote:
On Oct 4, 2019, WitchDocChris wrote:
With very little practice I've been able to locate random objects (I like to use it with a pool table - they pick a ball and I tell them which one it is), duplicate (simple) drawings

Any specific tips for using CMR to duplicate drawings? Which kind of grip do you use to be so precise? Which kind of movement pattern?

Quote:
On Oct 4, 2019, WitchDocChris wrote:
and do a seemingly method-free which hand.

For the which hand plot, do you use two persons, one holding the object and the other one helping you do find the object with CMR? Or only one person?
What would a real mindreader do?
kissdadookie
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Quote:
On Oct 3, 2019, Slim King wrote:
I would also suggest watching a real pro doing it live. I watched Kreskin do it and gleened half a dozen things I'd never have understood by just reading about it.


I've also watched Kreskin do it live. His approach was essentially to berate the participants so that as he went down the line of the available participants he had up on stage with him, each proceeding one will become more compliant as they themselves are fearing him berating them. It looks terrible and I feel like I can't in good conscience suggest to anyone to go and see how Kreskin does his muscle reading.

Now, Kreskin at the same time that he's using such abrasive techniques pummeling his participants (and audience for that matter), he is very effective at it because that abrasiveness that he's applying there is effective and thus indeed provides him success at finding the hidden object and able to do so relatively quickly, but the way it looks, it's terrible and simply abusive to your participants and audience.

I've also seen other folks do muscle reading without resorting to Kreskin's style of abusing his participants and audience BUT it does take a significantly longer time to find the object. It's also incredibly boring to watch. There's a reason why a lot of the contact mind reading/muscle reading stunts we have seen publicized and recorded to view has been heavily edited down so that it's not boring to watch. This does not mean that they cheated and used camera tricks, it's just that it's not feasible to air the stunt in it's entirety because it would take up so much time and be incredibly boring to watch.
WitchDocChris
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Quote:
On Oct 4, 2019, ipe wrote:
Any specific tips for using CMR to duplicate drawings? Which kind of grip do you use to be so precise? Which kind of movement pattern?


I more or less use Finley's 'grip' but I doubt it matters. It's more important to be able to visualize/remember what they're guiding you to 'draw'.

Quote:
For the which hand plot, do you use two persons, one holding the object and the other one helping you do find the object with CMR? Or only one person?


One person.
Christopher
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Psycho Seance book: https://tinyurl.com/y873bbr4
ipe
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Thank you Christopher. ;-)
What would a real mindreader do?
bofx
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Banachek's book is very good for getting started at CMR. An excellent quality/price ratio.
Hanussen's work is also a reference for me, I'm surprised that no one has mentioned it.
The Satori's book takes the outline of Hanussen's one.
FCMR is by far the most comprehensive on the subject... but also the most expensive.
But the real secret of learning CMR is to DO it.
My mentalism books: Mental Sweets 1 - Mental Sweets 2
Jerry
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Doc: "Though if the history of the Café is anything to go on, the OP has already bounced".

I concur.
The_MetalMaster
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If you ever get a chance to attend one of Richard Osterlind’s workshops or lectures, ask him to demonstrate CMR. Its truly amazing to watch him perform this. He just grabs the person’s hand and goes. His book on the same subject is highly recommended too.
kannon
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Adding support for FCMR it is a simply fantastic
My work and the Mtangulizi here http://kannonsworks.weebly.com featuring work on drawing duplications, a fiddle-free billet tear, bar mentalism, pendulums
Dr Ross
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Pete Turner offers some really useful advice and guidance on CMR in 'Bigger Fish Files'
Ross Bartels

Author of:
'Janken' (propless RPS effects) and 'Tacitus'
Tony Iacoviello
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Richard Osterlind has the most direct system I have come across and I witnessed his demonstrating this and it took his seconds to locate objects.

He has a book, Contact Mind Reading: The Osterlind Approach.
David Thiel
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I agree with Tony. Richard's book is the best I've read. No fluff. Just good teaching.

David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.


www.MindGemsBrainTrust.com
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www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com
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