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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Shuffled not Stirred » » Does anyone know of a marked deck with only mnemonica markings? (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

djsqzme
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Looking for a mnemonica marked deck i.e using its mnemonica stack position as markings (1-52) that is well hidden. Does anyone know if such a deck exists? I was going to create my own using bikes, but after testing on a old deck, it looked pretty obvious to me that they were marked. thanks!
djsqzme
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Trying to find something like this https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/m......-tamariz
Chris K
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Russ182
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I think Luke Jermay had the Marksman Deck , it had all sorts of hidden marks
djsqzme
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On Jan 20, 2020, Russ182 wrote:
I think Luke Jermay had the Marksman Deck , it had all sorts of hidden marks


thanks for the suggestion, but to me personally that deck has too many marks.
dclxvinyc
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I think the best marked deck is the one you mark yourself. Ive owned a few marketed ones and they're all lousy.
djsqzme
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Thanks dclxvinyc. think I'm going to have to do that!
Chris K
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On Jan 21, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
I think the best marked deck is the one you mark yourself. Ive owned a few marketed ones and they're all lousy.


I personally love the basic marking system in Doug Dyment's Idiopraxis: https://www.deceptionary.com/idiopraxis.html

Easy enough to modify to give you stack position as well (or instead) of the card.
dclxvinyc
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I will say that I prefer tactile markings to visual ones, and if you're using a stack, you don't need every card marked in the first place. so a small pin prick on 1, two on 13, three on 26, and four on 39 will give you a good orientation in your stack.
djsqzme
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On Jan 24, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
I will say that I prefer tactile markings to visual ones, and if you're using a stack, you don't need every card marked in the first place. so a small pin prick on 1, two on 13, three on 26, and four on 39 will give you a good orientation in your stack.


*** that's some next level stuff! thank you for sharing. I made the visual ones and I gotta say, its quite noticeable and I'm not a fan. the shine from the sharpies reflects light differently and bothers me quite a bit. will certainly give a shot at creating a tactile marking!
Poof-Daddy
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As mentioned in another linked thread - https://www.card-shark.de/index.cfm?page......rtID=108
comes stacked in mnemonica order, tells card cut to, stack number, how many cards have been cut off as well as how many of those are red and how many are black.
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dclxvinyc
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Quote:
On Jan 27, 2020, djsqzme wrote:
Quote:
On Jan 24, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
I will say that I prefer tactile markings to visual ones, and if you're using a stack, you don't need every card marked in the first place. so a small pin prick on 1, two on 13, three on 26, and four on 39 will give you a good orientation in your stack.


*** that's some next level stuff! thank you for sharing. I made the visual ones and I gotta say, its quite noticeable and I'm not a fan. the shine from the sharpies reflects light differently and bothers me quite a bit. will certainly give a shot at creating a tactile marking!



If you're going for visual marks, and you're using ink, don't use sharpies. They have a shine to them.
When possible use a small razor or needle and scratch a small amount of ink OFF from bike designs and this is what you look for.

Additionally, even with a borrowed deck, I will always put a downward facing breather crimp into the 9 of Diamonds. Being able to cut "back to one" in a stack is just as valuable as having a marked deck.
Moreover, remember if marking: mark with mnemonica number and not the card value. Abacus style and binary are great ways to convey a number without "writing the number" and using as little visual information as necessary.

The more you get used to a stack, the less, I feel, you will even want to use marked cards. In the back of mnemonica there is a great appendix where Tamariz goes into great detail on a variety of peeking techniques.

Also, the e-book "Road to Riffsville" is a great resource on peeking and using the stack as an index. Darwin Ortiz has a lot to say on using the stack as an index as well, but between the Tamariz appendix and a breather crimp you've got enough material to practice for a year.

I use mnemonica religiously. If you fall into any difficulty, you can DM me and I'm happy to work it through with you.

Best,
-Alex Smile
djsqzme
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Quote:
On Jan 28, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
Quote:
On Jan 27, 2020, djsqzme wrote:
Quote:
On Jan 24, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
I will say that I prefer tactile markings to visual ones, and if you're using a stack, you don't need every card marked in the first place. so a small pin prick on 1, two on 13, three on 26, and four on 39 will give you a good orientation in your stack.


*** that's some next level stuff! thank you for sharing. I made the visual ones and I gotta say, its quite noticeable and I'm not a fan. the shine from the sharpies reflects light differently and bothers me quite a bit. will certainly give a shot at creating a tactile marking!



If you're going for visual marks, and you're using ink, don't use sharpies. They have a shine to them.
When possible use a small razor or needle and scratch a small amount of ink OFF from bike designs and this is what you look for.

Additionally, even with a borrowed deck, I will always put a downward facing breather crimp into the 9 of Diamonds. Being able to cut "back to one" in a stack is just as valuable as having a marked deck.
Moreover, remember if marking: mark with mnemonica number and not the card value. Abacus style and binary are great ways to convey a number without "writing the number" and using as little visual information as necessary.

The more you get used to a stack, the less, I feel, you will even want to use marked cards. In the back of mnemonica there is a great appendix where Tamariz goes into great detail on a variety of peeking techniques.

Also, the e-book "Road to Riffsville" is a great resource on peeking and using the stack as an index. Darwin Ortiz has a lot to say on using the stack as an index as well, but between the Tamariz appendix and a breather crimp you've got enough material to practice for a year.

I use mnemonica religiously. If you fall into any difficulty, you can DM me and I'm happy to work it through with you.

Best,
-Alex Smile


Yep I've read road to riffsville it was a great e-book!! I'll definitely buy a razor and experiment some scratching some ink off like you had suggested. have been using breather crimp on 9D as well, it's been super helpful. I need to work on my false shuffles and false cuts. I was watching Darwin's PM lecture and I've been setting up the deck 2 outfaro's away from mnemonica but sometimes it takes me 2 or 3 tries to get the perfect faro shuffle. There is still a lot of work ahead of me to be able to do routines with the stack and keep the stack in order afterwards. Sometimes it takes me a second or two to think about where the card is in the stack and I know it should be instant. Thanks for your tips Alex! By the way, where are you resided if you don't mind sharing. Do you perform anywhere? I'd love to come watch you.
Chris K
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Quote:
On Jan 28, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
Quote:
On Jan 27, 2020, djsqzme wrote:
Quote:
On Jan 24, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
I will say that I prefer tactile markings to visual ones, and if you're using a stack, you don't need every card marked in the first place. so a small pin prick on 1, two on 13, three on 26, and four on 39 will give you a good orientation in your stack.


*** that's some next level stuff! thank you for sharing. I made the visual ones and I gotta say, its quite noticeable and I'm not a fan. the shine from the sharpies reflects light differently and bothers me quite a bit. will certainly give a shot at creating a tactile marking!



If you're going for visual marks, and you're using ink, don't use sharpies. They have a shine to them.
When possible use a small razor or needle and scratch a small amount of ink OFF from bike designs and this is what you look for.

Additionally, even with a borrowed deck, I will always put a downward facing breather crimp into the 9 of Diamonds. Being able to cut "back to one" in a stack is just as valuable as having a marked deck.
Moreover, remember if marking: mark with mnemonica number and not the card value. Abacus style and binary are great ways to convey a number without "writing the number" and using as little visual information as necessary.

The more you get used to a stack, the less, I feel, you will even want to use marked cards. In the back of mnemonica there is a great appendix where Tamariz goes into great detail on a variety of peeking techniques.

Also, the e-book "Road to Riffsville" is a great resource on peeking and using the stack as an index. Darwin Ortiz has a lot to say on using the stack as an index as well, but between the Tamariz appendix and a breather crimp you've got enough material to practice for a year.

I use mnemonica religiously. If you fall into any difficulty, you can DM me and I'm happy to work it through with you.

Best,
-Alex Smile


I use Letraset pens, not sharpies, to do my own marking. Acrylic pens can work well also if you find a good match.

I disagree with Alex, but only slightly. I put a top cutting breather into the 4C and a bottom cutting breather in the KD. That lets me tell whether the spectator cut the 4C to the top (can see the breather) versus figuring out if the breather is on the bottom. Just works for me. I also put corner shorts in some cards (upper right vs upper left).

I mean, if I am going to put some work into a deck, I PUT SOME WORK INTO THE DECK! ;-)
JBSmith1978
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White paint pens work for edge marks, a grey would be better if using many.
I used to put a few breathers in but I bounced around so much that I only use them in the fly.
I have two marked with a sharpie for an effect that uses Aronson’s Undo Influence principle.
dclxvinyc
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Actually, Chris K: Letraset and Micron pens are awesome for marking. I used some to color match my purple monarchs and it worked like a charm!

that's a lot of work in the deck, man. It's good to know people are really turning the stack into a swiss army knife! I used to corner short every 4th card as a way of counting when I used the deck as an index. I stopped doing it once my estimation and peeking got better.

Trust me, I love gaffing the hell out of a pack of cards, but most of what I do lately is so hands off that a lot of gaff work just isn't helping me.


djsqzme, I live in New York. I've done a couple of shows here and there and I'd like to do much more. But honestly, I mostly hold court at my local bars and entertain for friends.
Riffsville is such a thoughtful work. Putting the work into really feeling comfortable with a me deck is a lonely road sometimes. And even if I don't use the material, I really like to hear other performers' thoughts on it. For years I used the formula: estimate, cut, peek, pinky count, double undercut. But there is so much more to mem deck than cutting cards to the top or bottom. I'll definitely be looking more into Michael's work.
I also appreciate that he had video links throughout the book.
Chris K
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Quote:
On Jan 29, 2020, dclxvinyc wrote:
Actually, Chris K: Letraset and Micron pens are awesome for marking...

that's a lot of work in the deck, man. It's good to know people are really turning the stack into a swiss army knife! I used to corner short every 4th card as a way of counting when I used the deck as an index. I stopped doing it once my estimation and peeking got better.

Trust me, I love gaffing the hell out of a pack of cards, but most of what I do lately is so hands off that a lot of gaff work just isn't helping me...


Yeah, I learned about the Letraset pens from Doug Dyment's work (I use his marking system, or a modification thereof to be more accurate). I like them!

My wife laughs her butt off at me. On the desk, I have my marked deck with all the work in (in stacked deck order), a deck in stacked deck order, a deck in stacked deck order with the set-up for Asi Wind's ACAAN, a deck in stacked deck order with the set-up for Redford's Ninja Deck (or Tossed out Ninja or something like that), a deck for non-stack work, AND a deck for R.M.R. (from Architect of the Mind). It's totally ridiculous!

All that said, I also have a deck at work, in stack order, that I use for tricks. If I do a trick requiring the stack (Supervision, Crossing Over, etc.), I'm set, if not, I have them shuffle and move into (usually) Double Exposure and Las Vegas Leaper (this quarter's routines).
dclxvinyc
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Oh man, double exposure is such a good trick. Everything Asi does with cards is beautiful.

Is Dyment's marking system in Mindsights? I've been meaning to pick it up for a while, but the meat of it is in learning a new stack -- which I'm not interested in doing.

I get it. Every opened deck of cards in my house is stacked to mnemonica before being put back in the box. And there are hundreds of decks of cards in my house. I go to a lot of bars that have cards and I always make sure to ask for the deck and stack it. I have a game of solitaire that I play that leaves the deck in order. If anyone is in NYC and wants to ask for the deck at a bar with a good chance of it being in mnemonica, I'll provide a full list in a DM.
Chris K
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I believe Dyment’s “Bike Marks” are in Idiopraxis. https://www.deceptionary.com/idiopraxis.html I do not use any of his stacks, for playing or esp cards. Mindsights is still a great book and modifications of his mem deck effect can be pretty strong. Of course, I think his magic square work is awesome. Idiopraxis has a lot of that work in it.

And, as I’m getting older, I also bought the “Low Vision Marking System” by Hans-Christian Solka on Lybrary. I thought Dyment’s was still superior. I made some modifications of course. Also, and I’ve been meaning to post this because there was a long time it would have been helpful to me: https://www.lybrary.com/ted-lesleys-work......241.html
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