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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9491 Posts 
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When I visited the Louvre back in 1965 my friend and I got bored/inundated after room after room of art with seemingly little distinction and a droning guide in French I scarcely understood. We noticed that every room had a small fireplace edged with incredible tiles. We back checked a dozen rooms to verify that each room was different in pattern, color, etc. This attracted the attention of a guard and other visitors who also began examining the tiles. A curator arrived and explained that indeed, when the Palace was built each room tile was commissioned to be different and made by dozens of different kilns across France. After that, all of the tourists went to look at tiles along with the pictures on the walls. It is my understanding that an explanation of the tiles was added to the printed guide book.
At what point did these tiles become art? The care of the artisan? The will of the architect? Our noticing their uniqueness? That they are in an art museum? The printing of a brochure? The experience was magical but certainly not magic.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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The question is, what works; a talking frog or a princess?
A young magician was crossing a road one day when a frog called out to him and said, "If you kiss me, I'll turn into a beautiful princess." He bent over, picked up the frog and put it in his pocket. The frog spoke up again and said, "If you kiss me and turn me back into a beautiful princess, I will stay with you for one week." The young magician took the frog out of his pocket, smiled at it and returned it to his pocket. The frog then cried out, "If you kiss me and turn me back into a princess, I'll stay with you and do ANYTHING you want." Again the young magician took the frog out, smiled at it and put it back into his pocket. Finally, the frog asked, "What is the matter? I've told you I'm a beautiful princess, that I'll stay with you for a week and do anything you want. Why won't you kiss me?" The young magician said, "Look I'm a magician. I don't have time for a girlfriend, but a talking frog is cool."
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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The tiles became art when they were created by the arm of man; prior to that, they were nature.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 2980 Posts
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Quote:
On Dec 27, 2020, funsway wrote: They didn't become art. Certainly the care of the artisan had to do with their popularity, but they were originally intended to be decorative elements in the palace, and apparently they were. Nothing more. What most people don't realize is that a huge lot of the people we call "artists" nowadays were considered craftsmen or artisans back in their day. And the vast majority made works on commission, not to hang in a museum. In fact, the word "masterpiece" was originally just that: a work created as proof that a journeyman was ready to become a master and start his own workshop and take apprentices. Kinda along the lines of a master's thesis in a university.
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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What is the difference between a Vase and a Tile in a museum?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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George Ledo Magic Café Columnist SF Bay Area 2980 Posts
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You can think whatever you want to think about a field (art) you obviously don't know anything about. That's your prerogative and I'm okay with it.
I'm done with this thread. Happy New Year, all.
That's our departed buddy Burt, aka The Great Burtini, doing his famous Cups and Mice routine
www.georgefledo.net Latest column: "Sorry about the photos in my posts here" |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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The difference is the tile is an Earthenware tile, dust-pressed body with moulded decoration simulating tube lining in the form of a stylized peacock feather in the Art Nouveau style in bold coloured glazes of yellow, green, blue and brown; Maker's mark on reverse. And the vase is a piece of junk, called modern art, commissioned by the CIA to wind up the Soviet Empire.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5YSikO6JRM
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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If a magician is a man playing the role of a magician, then what is a vase, if it isn’t clay playing the role of a vase?
You know, you really need to understand the word understand to prevent vases and the like fooling you again.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5129 Posts
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Quote:
On Dec 27, 2020, tommy wrote: Laugh of the day. Thanks.
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
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Josh Riel Inner circle of hell 1999 Posts
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I too would take a talking frog over a princess any day!
I've watched Shrek, seems like a lot of work. Would I have to babysit the Dragon/donkey babies? Also, my wife would get jealous.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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Artless: free from deceit, not artificial; natural.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 20870 Posts
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My lord did that joke pop up on Facebook? It is about a billion years old. But I keep seeing people telling it in different places as if it were new.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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Perhaps, but I would not know since I do not have Facebook.
Art is based on imitation. In the case of the art being an imitation of Art, then spell it with a small case a. But whatever the case may be, always remember, it is the way you tell them lies that really matters.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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1KJ Inner circle Warning: We will run out of new tricks in 4003 Posts
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This is an old thread, but for anyone who stumbles on it, I would suggest watching the second Dani DaOrtiz penguin Live lecture where he talks about how if you are entertaining, then the audience will enjoy it, and if you aren't entertaining, then they won't. Of course, magic is your vehicle, so you need to be as proficient as you can.
I think that the reason David Blaine was so successful is because of two things: 1. His magic is good., but secondly, 2. He is like watching an anomaly. It's like Zombie magic. He is entertaining like watching a Zombie movie. Only one of those wouldn't cut it. I think a better example of an outstanding magician who doesn't have long patter is Jeki Yoo. His magic is phenomenal, AND his personality is HIGHLY entertaining. So, you don't need long patter, but you must be likeable and skilled. KJ |
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Pop Haydn Inner circle Los Angeles 3596 Posts
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How does one make him/herself likeable?
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9491 Posts
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Quote:
On Jan 21, 2021, 1KJ wrote: This is debatable, or at least begs the question, "Relative to what?" If the objective of "good magic" is to leave the memory "inexplicable - no possible explanation," then the efforts to 'be likable" or even "to entertain" can work against this goal as being a skill demonstration or allowing a reveal of method (or deliberate). Or is magic "good" if it produces the desired result of applause, repeat bookings or acclaim? I will agree that "magical" is often more entertaining the strong magic, but that "ain't good" if it attracts (ed) newbies with a 'buy today, perform tomorrow' attitude. Some of what Whit does (did) is strong magic and some only magical, but all are entertaining as he presents them - they may not be with other trying to emulate. Is his character likable? Read his notes on changes over the years. He can be irritating at times - character and self  but his stuff is "good." Magic - not always
opinions, of course, but with greatest respect.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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Quote:
On Jan 21, 2021, Pop Haydn wrote: Agree with everybody.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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Pop Haydn Inner circle Los Angeles 3596 Posts
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Agree with the audience? About what?
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tommy Eternal Order Devil’s Island 16356 Posts
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Whenever one asks the audience a question one will normally agree with their answer. “There are no more Queens in the deck? Thanks!" "But are we all quite sure that the cards on the table are the four Queens? Please examine them.” "They are the four Queens?”
Ladies and gentlemen, my next trick is called the secret of peace and tranquillity, which is a most unusual trick because we will all know the secret.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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Pop Haydn Inner circle Los Angeles 3596 Posts
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That sort of agreement won't make you "likeable."
My question was serious. I hear people recommend performers be "likeable" all the time. What does that mean? How does one go about it? |
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| The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Food for thought » » I'll probably get my butt kicked for saying this. (39 Likes) | ||||||||||
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Posted: Dec 27, 2020 10:55 am 
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