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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » What is mentalism FOR? (38 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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David Thiel
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As we seem to be coming out of the deep freeze and appear to be headed back (please, God) onstage...I have been thinking about this question quite a bit lately: "What is mentalism FOR?"

By this I mean: what role does it fulfill in this modern world? Is it Art? A Performance? Theatre? Therapy? Pure entertainment? Trickery? Shamanism?

When you perform, and it doesn't matter if you are a pro or a hobbyist...what is that performance FOR? To state it again: What is mentalism FOR?

Very curious to hear what you all think about this.

David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.

My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com
www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com
The Unmasked Magician
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I think I can only really answer this for myself. For me it is an enjoyable way to connect with people on a different level.
Please check regularly if you are becoming the type of magician Jerry Seinfeld jokes about. (This applies to mentalists as well.)
The Unmasked Magician
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If I may ask: what is mentalism for in your life, David? (PS The reason I'm not calling it Art/Entertaiment/etc. is that I think that decision is up to each audience member individually. I can can only say what mentalism is for in my life)
Please check regularly if you are becoming the type of magician Jerry Seinfeld jokes about. (This applies to mentalists as well.)
WitchDocChris
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Quote:
On Jun 25, 2021, David Thiel wrote:
As we seem to be coming out of the deep freeze and appear to be headed back (please, God) onstage...I have been thinking about this question quite a bit lately: "What is mentalism FOR?"

By this I mean: what role does it fulfill in this modern world? Is it Art? A Performance? Theatre? Therapy? Pure entertainment? Trickery? Shamanism?

When you perform, and it doesn't matter if you are a pro or a hobbyist...what is that performance FOR? To state it again: What is mentalism FOR?

Very curious to hear what you all think about this.

David


Mentalism, or MY mentalism?

Mentalism as a general term? You said it already - A Performance? Theatre? Therapy? Pure entertainment? Trickery? Shamanism?

All those and more are options, as they are with any expressive art form. Comes down to the individual's goals.

My goal is genuine development of my mental skills, and displaying those skills in entertaining ways to show people what the mind is capable of when trained. Somewhere between entertainer and motivational speaker, I guess. I find this stuff truly fascinating so I just have to find others who also think it's interesting.
Christopher
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funsway
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Mentalism can be/is a form of communication. So is conjuring, demonstrating weird science and posing riddles/puzzles.
So, it is important to understand what the other person(s) understands and expects of the interaction. They may be confused as to what you are about.

What is now called Mentalism as a tool for entertainment is different from what some might expect of an exploration into "mind based" or "paranormal" events.
I feel that most coming to see a Mentalist perform are looking validation of some pervious experience, personal or from a trusted other.

Folks in a random audience may not see (or desire) any distinction between the various possibilities of entertainment - expecting to see something unusual,
and going home feeling good about the experience. I never claim to do Mentalism, but can meet that expectation of the audience expects it.

Ideally, a Mental based phenomenon presentation is a way of the observer to test beliefs and understanding of the paranormal without risk.
The want a real experience of telepathy, farsight, telempathy, etc. rather than a "an experience of real telepathy."
The guise of entertainment is an "out" for those whose level of certainty is taken to far, whole others can take credit for being part of something incredible.

My task is to discover what they expect, nurture it, and give them something more. Mental based effects is just one way of doing that.

Of course, I am not trying to make a living from performing and don't have a booking agent to satisfy.

I also never do prediction demonstrations. If you can understand why, then you might touch on what I think Mentalism is for.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

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John C
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It's a fun challenge to perform. (Not to challenge others.)
Philemon Vanderbeck
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To expand expectations of the perceived limits of the human mind.
Professor Philemon Vanderbeck
That Creepy Magician
"I use my sixth sense to create the illusion of possessing the other five."
The great Gumbini
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To me mentalism is fully answered and expressed in all the answers above.

Good magic to all,


Eric
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The question wasn't necessarily what is mentalism to YOU. It was what is if FOR. Of course instantly nearly everyone takes it to their own context of "me" which of course is so telling.

The answer from an industry perspective (the only one that really counts) is to demonstrate a showcase of the mental arts. A demonstration or performance of mental abilities, often with psi.

Mentalism is bigger than just you. It's what mentalism is simply by expectation and definition. No one wants to see a fake mentalist or false showcase of the mental arts. It's not anything to do with personal preference, personal belief, nothing about magic, body language, etc.

As a entertainment/talent broker I have worked with and booked mentalism all over the world and it is really the same everywhere.

Meeting the definition and expectation should be the primary goal of every mentalism performer.

When someone books or pays to attend a mentalism show they expect to see a demonstration of mental abilities and the mental arts and sciences. Yes, as part of a good demonstration and performance there should include art, theatrics, drama, suspense, comedy, interaction and so on. As far as therapy, Shamanism and other similar that is a matter of style, persona, and positioning.

What is mentalism for? To meet or exceed the expectations of those experiencing the mentalism.
funsway
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Yes,Mindpro, it "is so telling" that you only focus on performances for a paying audience and your imagined list of their expectations that you cannot possible "know."
I am not disagreeing with your list as a performer on stage must make planning assumption in designing a show. Your opinion just isn't complete enough for the real world.

For the majority of performers involved in a 'lesser' types of performance, some work may have to be done to determine expectations and respond accordingly.
So, "what Mentalism is for" is engaging the audience of the moment in a unique way involving mental based abilities or phenomena.
In many/most situations a performer does not know what the expectations are, and it may vary for each person.

Properly done they will go home remembering a delightful experience of "other than normal" mental ability - and share that experience with others.

I did not know that it is possible to "book mentalism," but am always open to learn.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
BillGladwell
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As with any live entertainment, mentalism is a vehicle to help audience members forget about life for a while. I believe many magicians and mentalists think the audience has come to see them—they've come to be entertained. They don't care what you say, they don't care what bits you do, and they don't care about billets and gaffed envelopes. They care about and remember how you make them feel during the show.

If mentalism was banned from being performed, I would still be on a stage with hyp show, playing piano, speaking, or doing stand-up comedy.

There is a clear distinction between a mentalist performing for an audience and an entertainer using mentalism to give the audience an experience. One is focused on themselves, and the other is focused on the audience.
John C
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Well mindpro I don't think your analysis is fair as far as me me me because the OP ambiguous question begs any type of reply:

"When you perform, and it doesn't matter if you are a pro or a hobbyist...what is that performance FOR? To state it again: What is mentalism FOR?"

So, when I perform the performance is a challenge FOR me. Whatever the audience gets out of it is up to them, I can't control that. I can only do the best I can and they do the best they can in resolving it.
The Unmasked Magician
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Well said, John.
Please check regularly if you are becoming the type of magician Jerry Seinfeld jokes about. (This applies to mentalists as well.)
David Thiel
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My question was intentionally ambiguous. I wanted to see what people would do with it...apply it to themselves, the audience, or the larger performing 'world.'

I've always thought -- and this is just my thought and not a condemnation of anyone else -- that when my mentalism starts to be all about ME, I have failed. There's no sharing of anything when the performer is about showing off HIS 'skills' and HIS show. Not to sound overly flowery -- but a mentalism show should be a shared experience. The performer is certainly the conduit and the 'engine' -- but the show itself is the synthesis of what happens when a number of people come together over and around the theme of mentalism. It's a journey everyone goes on: performer AND audience and that indefinable something that is generated when all the different elements all blend together. I love that I never know what's going to happen or what direction the show is going to take. The active 'ingredient' -- the audience is always changing.

In a nutshell, to me a mentalism show is about WONDER. I don't mean that in the airy fairy way. I mean literal WONDER. It's the possibility that those in the audience can brush up against something truly unexplainable. I really see a well crafted mentalism show in terms of a splash of bright unexpected colour against an all too often grey world.

Magic was much easier to perform -- for me anyway. You can follow a formula -- and once you have mastered the nuances and techniques -- it's a simple matter of going out and performing. I had the advantage of showy props and music and absolute freedom from having to present any aspect of that third layer unique to mentalism: that it is something happening right before you that just might be real. As a magician I simply had to entertain people.

A mentalist also has to entertain people. He does so with a few scraps of paper...a pen...a book...MAYBE a chalkboard and a massive presumption: that he is going to present something that skirts the world you KNOW and the one you have always half suspected might be real. Huge difference with a much more challenging agenda.


I love that

David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.

My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com
www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com
Christopher Taylor
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Mentalism is for showing people an alternate view of the world.

CT
Christopher Taylor

Member P.E.A.

www.taylorimagineering.com

MAKING MENTALISM MORE IMPOSSIBLE
Sudo Nimh
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My answer to this has changed several times over the years. As it stands right now, I view it as a form of self-expression. "Self-expression" doesn't necessarily mean "self-centered" - there is a difference between these things.
John C
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Quote:
On Jun 27, 2021, Sudo Nimh wrote:
My answer to this has changed several times over the years. As it stands right now, I view it as a form of self-expression. "Self-expression" doesn't necessarily mean "self-centered" - there is a difference between these things.


Hey Sudo, I suggest you better explain the terms or others here will do it for you. Haha

Sarcastic.
snm
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“ The mindreading act, whether on stage, radio, club or park lot is a unique ballyhoo for the sale of
something. Usually it is a book of Psychology, Astrology or other “ologies.” A horoscope, a dream
book, an alleged charm-something is offered for sale. The purpose of the act is not only to Entertain,
but to create a demand for the purchase of this merchandise. This revenue ofttimes far exceeds the
salary paid”.

“Mentalism is a commercial-mercenary. If you wish. It functions only for
profit”.

- Robert Nelson 1944 Encyclopedia of Mentalism and the Related Arts.
David Thiel
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“As a mentalist, you must become accustomed to perpetrating outright swindles without so much as a twinge of conscience.”
Tony Corinda
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.

My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com
www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com
The great Gumbini
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As a mentalist and as a human being I learned a long time ago I could never answer what something means to someone else that would be an assumption I would not dare to make but I am fully qualified to answer the question as to what a subject means to me. Mentalism to me is another form of entertainment. If we as Mentalist entertainers could really do what we pretend to do we would all be multi-millionaires with people and dignitaries all around the world wanting to hold court with us. Which is good for your business because if we could do what we make believe we can do there would be no need for an entertainment/ Talent broker. But to sum all of this up to me and yes that's all I can answer for mentalism is about entertainment and entertaining and is a lot of fun when it stops being any of those things I will no longer be a mentalist.


Good magic to all,


Eric
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