On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:
....was indisputably first published and released to market, albeit very limitedly, by Michael Weber.

On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:
You guys are conflating a number of issues for your own connivence.

Yes, Magic Age Cards is an age old principle, one of the oldest in magic. Taking this principle and applying to to receipts however was indisputably first published and released to market, albeit very limitedly, by Michael Weber.

Some of you seem to still be in denial of this very simple fact and have even fabricated out of whole cloth vast conspiracies and networks of various nefarious actors all designed to take down Craig Petty, a laughably amusing fantasy.


Further, I suspect the vast majority of purchasers will end up disappointed with this release and that most of the seven hours of content Craig keeps touting will be filler material. However, that's only my opinion. That Michael Weber came up with and published this same idea first is a matter of fact, whether or not any of you choose to believe it. It certainly seems Craig chose not to believe it and now we've ended up where we are.

On Feb 6, 2023, influentialist wrote:
We have now now reached peak "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

On Feb 6, 2023, Sudo Nimh wrote:

Quote:

On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:
....was indisputably first published and released to market, albeit very limitedly, by Michael Weber.

A limited subscription-based model is not the same as "to market". Do you disagree that the way they handled Craig wasn't even remotely fair?

On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:

Quote:

On Feb 6, 2023, Sudo Nimh wrote:

Quote:

On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:
....was indisputably first published and released to market, albeit very limitedly, by Michael Weber.

A limited subscription-based model is not the same as "to market". Do you disagree that the way they handled Craig wasn't even remotely fair?

Based on Craig's version of events? Yes, I do.

He reads off a few choice excerpts from what are probably MANY email exchanges back and forth and that is somehow supposed to represent a whole, complete, and truthful recounting of events? Craig obviously has an incentive to- as he puts it, "control the narrative," in a way that suits him. Arguably the other guys have the exact same incentive. I'm not here to argue about any of that, I never have, only to state the clear and simple fact the other guys did it first.

The fact that Craig was unaware of this is forgivable, Weber even says as much in his first email and goes so far as to compliment Craig on coming up with a great idea, an easy compliment to give as Weber came up with it first. Craig immediately and defensively responds from a position that Weber has fabricated a story in order to prevent Craig from moving forward with his project, undoubtedly because he still holds a grudge over the Red fiasco.

Craig has a very well documented history, that he himself has published on youtube, spanning over a decade of him drumming up controversy for his own benefit. It may be cynical, but it's very hard for me to separate Craig's history from this current situation.

On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:
You guys are conflating a number of issues for your own connivence.

Yes, Magic Age Cards is an age old principle, one of the oldest in magic. Taking this principle and applying to to receipts however was indisputably first published and released to market, albeit very limitedly, by Michael Weber.

Some of you seem to still be in denial of this very simple fact and have even fabricated out of whole cloth vast conspiracies and networks of various nefarious actors all designed to take down Craig Petty, a laughably amusing fantasy.


Further, I suspect the vast majority of purchasers will end up disappointed with this release and that most of the seven hours of content Craig keeps touting will be filler material. However, that's only my opinion. That Michael Weber came up with and published this same idea first is a matter of fact, whether or not any of you choose to believe it. It certainly seems Craig chose not to believe it and now we've ended up where we are.

On Feb 6, 2023, Intrepid wrote:
Drop the bs

On Feb 6, 2023, da5id wrote:
So limited as to be useless in due diligence. That’s the main point.

The fact that Craig was unaware of this is forgivable, Weber even says as much in his first email and goes so far as to compliment Craig on coming up with a great idea, an easy compliment to give as Weber came up with it first. Craig immediately and defensively responds from a position that Weber has fabricated a story in order to prevent Craig from moving forward with his project, undoubtedly because he still holds a grudge over the Red fiasco.

On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:

Quote:

On Feb 6, 2023, da5id wrote:
So limited as to be useless in due diligence. That’s the main point.

You missed this point:

Quote:

The fact that Craig was unaware of this is forgivable, Weber even says as much in his first email and goes so far as to compliment Craig on coming up with a great idea, an easy compliment to give as Weber came up with it first. Craig immediately and defensively responds from a position that Weber has fabricated a story in order to prevent Craig from moving forward with his project, undoubtedly because he still holds a grudge over the Red fiasco.

On Feb 6, 2023, Mac_Stone wrote:
Yes, Magic Age Cards is an age old principle, one of the oldest in magic. Taking this principle and applying to to receipts however was indisputably first published and released to market, albeit very limitedly, by Michael Weber.

Background: Maven, Trono, Weber, Heath, Becker, Gardner. This version developed by Real Secrets

On Feb 3, 2023, newguy wrote:
I think this is Craig trying to get away with the same stuff he pulled with Red and Bob King’s New Wave Prediction.

Craig 100% stole it and put it out as his own creation. He openly and regularly admits it even though he had a similar long list of excuses and accusations in the past.

Webber was an old friend of King and paid Bob for the rights so he could go after Craig and set the record straight.

Craig went into hiding for several years after.

He reemerged with his new online series and has continually acknowledged his past wrongful actions and lies and admitted that the claims of King and Webber were correct.

I don't know anything about the back and forth emails being discussed, but as a Charter Member of Real Secrets, an owner of The Works mentalism kit, a longtime subscriber to Genii and the Journal of Psience I know that Webber has published, printed, shared, sold and released at least four different versions of the age receipts, the first I saw in 2012.

I think that Craig got caught with his hand in the cookie jar AGAIN by the same person for the same thing.

My guess is that the reason he didn’t say anything about transaction is because his issue isn’t with receipt mentalism, its that Fowler’s Transaction is Grant’s Tru-Test with reciepts, while Craig’s release is identical to what Webber released more than a decade ago - Age Cards designed to look like receipts.

My money says we’ll have more tears, tirades and excuses from Petty and Webber will just keep creating great magic. I just hope BS like this doesn’t make Webber stop sharing.

On Feb 6, 2023, mralincoln wrote:
Without getting into the Petty/Weber debate specifics, based on some of the arguments being made here (related to limited subscription releases not being “public”), it sounds as if some believe one could subscribe to Craig Petty’s Netflix or Lloyd Barnes’ Secret Society or Christian Grace’s Magic Monthly, learn any of the secrets/effects offered, and market (sell) those effects and/or their “improvements “ as their own.