Roth did a lot of prop tricks in his formal shows. Anyone doing prop tricks today, and if so, in what venue?

I haven't finished this yet but I found a miniature recycling bin (like the kind you'd see on a suburban curb, flip-top lid( at the Dollars Store and wanted to work out a routine involving a recycling theme. Now that pennies are on the outs Maybe recycling them into something else that comes out of the bin.

David Roth taught how to make the bottle with the label inside, and the removable label, in his Live in Philadelphia lecture which is on the Stars of Magic DVD #9.

Great, I will need to check that out! I have the entire series, but haven't looked at them in a very long time. That original video from Videonics was released in 1985, right after his book came out. I am surprised he didn't want to reveal the secret in both his book, and later on the A1 video from years later.

I just watched it. Yes, he goes into great detail on how to make the bottle. He says he had held onto that routine for years, and Kaufman wanted it for the book (hence the reference in the book to the use of a Heineken bottle for the Coin in Bottle effect), which dates Roth's inside out bottle idea to years before 1985.

OK, I just derailed this thread again, but to get back on topic, I imagine he did this for the public as it took such a long time to make up the bottle, he would have gotten good use out of it

And now, back to Coin Magic today. I asked earlier if anyone does prop tricks. After working with Roth for years, I came to the realization that prop tricks not only help to vary your magic, but serve to make your magic more entertaining. For example, I love doing Coins across (and over the years have come up with many versions) but I really love doing MIGRATE (with bear poker chips) because 1. It is funny (punny), 2. It is magical 3. It is entertaining. 4. Poker chips allow you to vary your magic by inserting something that is neither coins or cards. And, by changing the patter to bird migration, it can be done with half dollars or dollars with eagles on one side. I have an example of that on my YouTube channel. That is an example of prop magic that can be done formally (show), or for EDC. There are many props that can be carried with you for informal magic. An Okito box, a purse, a sharpie, a handkerchief, an eraser, a ring, etc., are all items that can be considered props because not only do they expand on the magic you do, they can be carried with you, ready to perform at a moment’s notice. And yet, in a formal show, bigger props make your magic play bigger. However, less practical for EDC because of their size.

Critter, love the miniature recycling bin idea - so original, and so many thoughts about what you can do with that! Great idea!

It took me years to accept that I was erroneously developping routines in applying story telling to existing technical effects. After passing my early 40s (I'm now 76), I consideredd to stop starting from the classic technical routines and started building routines from emotional EFFECTS.
I found the roots to such effects in Fitzkee's Trick Brain (see below). Then from discussions with friends (abd mentors) like Pop Haydn, Tommy Wonder, René Lavand, I started developping emotional stories involving several effects instead of just one like in Coins Across (teleportation), Coins through the table (solid through solid, Vanishes which spectators don't accept: check Kurtis Kam on this)...I developed the following approach (not universal but rich enough)
1) introducing the coins (their value goes up when paper money goes down) : value your props with an emotional lie about how you got the coins you using (magic is all about lying: demo of skill is not magic: read Dai Vernon on this. If the performer's skill is accountable for the effect, it's no longer "magic", it's just a challenge of the "catch me if you can¨ type)
2) a protagonist which can never be the performer (or his family, relatives, etc) as this becomes automatically a challenge. Thus your script should always get rid of the "You" and "I" to be replaced by "We" placing the spectator on the audience side. As a consequence, you may try to avoid the sitting behind a table (a fence betweeen the audience and the performer. If a table is necessary it should be light and initially by the performer's side. Involving a spectator's emotions (wealth, fame, artistic talent, family responsibility, search for its origin and essence, subtle sexual reference like handsomeness, confrontation with death, health issues...) offer good vectors
3) an antagonist which is stronger or more powerful than the protagonist (natural laws like the table that cannot let other solid go through, or like the bottle that cannot be penetrated by a coin too large to get in it
4) Very emotional conflicts between the protagonist and the antagonist where the protagonist fails and the antagonist resists the protagonists attempts
5) Climax where the Magic is finally accountable for the triumph of the protagonist

Thus the problem is not between coin magic and card magic (what about sponge balls, chop cup, animations or levitation of props, color changing knives, soap bubbles...) it lays in the story. However coins are basically emotional... I'm now using bit coins which have the misterious non physical and fixed value... (and I had a shell made by the French dealer "le petit magicien"

Now here are two lists of effects from Fitzkee's Trick Brain (naturally several effects are involved in one single routine to illustrate the emotional conflict)
SEVENTEEN FUNDAMENTAL EFFECTS
By Winston Freer
I-Production
2-Vanish
3-Change in position
4-Change in material
5-Change in form
6-Change in color
7-Change in size
8-Change in temperature
9-Change in weight
10-Magnetism
11-Levitation
12-Penetration
13-Restoration
14-Remote control
15-Sympathy
16-Divination (Comprising all feats of mental magic)
17-Prediction

and By S. H. Sharpe
1-Productions (From not being to being)
2-Disappearances (From being to not being)
3-Transformations (From being in this way to being in that)
4-Transpositions (From being here to being there)
5-Natural science laws defied
a-Anti-gravity
b-Magical animation
c-Magical control
d-Matter Through Matter
e-Multi-position
f-Restoration
g-Invulnerability
h-Rapid germination
6-Mental phenomena
a-Prediction
b-Divination
c-Clairvoyance
d-Telepathy or thought transference
e-Hypnotism
f-Memorization
g-Lightning calculations

With this, even without Funsway's exceptional writing talent and Dr Rubinstein's technical expertise we can share (not show) an infinite variation of routines using coins
As it is often stated "The Sky is the Limit"

(hioe that this help coin magicians to unlock their imaginations)

Thank you. I've been thinking on it and what I'm thinking could be fun is a bunch of coins and finally a lump of coal go in and a piece of diamond jewelry come out.

I think it might be a fun exercise to create a challenge where people find an item in a thrift or dollar store and come up with a story for it. Maybe in the story magic section.

Snushy, you are a genius to have found that. From all magicians, thanks!!!
To the supreme magician vampire, Lawrence O, I am so impressed with your
essay, I will have to take time to absorb it to appreciate it. I
have always been a huge fan of the Trick Brain by Fitzkee.

Ettienne, good to see you posting again! Great essay on how to think creatively. I hope it helps to encourage others to look at everyday objects and think about what could be done with them in the context of (coin) magic! I remember Roth talking about how he put props together in forming his routine. For his Portable Hold Routine he talked about a bagless purse being an incomplete object because it was missing a bag, and a hole being incomplete because it lacked depth (I think he said something more esoteric, but for the life of me I can't remember!). But the end result was he put these incomplete objects together. Same idea with the sleeve and mirror, both were spectator's thoughts that coin magic must be done with mirrors or sleeves, so he brought those ideas together and created an amazing routine!
I think more can be done with images on coins, and now you can get colorized coins that emphasize images, and create new ones (photo images on coins). I do a routine with colorized images of Santa for a Christmas routine. The color makes the routine more visible. Magicalaurie in this thread showed the potential of using the images on the backs of coins for her own routine. So much to be explored with this.

I remember seeing the Bagless purse in "The Escape Artist" and immediately started tearing bags off of coin purses and those clasp style cigarette cases. I thought that was jusr the greatest thing I'd ever seen at the time. I was just a kid. But it's still ONE OF the greatest things I've ever seen and that's still my second favorite magic movie.