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ninja
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Dear Everyone,

I'm looking at books by Peter Duffie and Sadowitz, mainly Card Zones, and pretty much all of Peter's material seems to be described as "<x> amount of new awesome effects!"

What exactly are 'effects'? Are they card tricks? Or flourishes like color changes, etc..

Thanks
brownitus
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Effects, to my knowledge, are basically, yeah, "card tricks."

peace.
"Everything that can be invented has been invented." - Charles H. Duell, US Commissioner of Patents, 1899
gilbreath76
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Quote:
On 2002-08-13 05:05, ninja wrote:
Dear Everyone,

I'm looking at books by Peter Duffie and Sadowitz, mainly Card Zones, and pretty much all of Peter's material seems to be described as "<x> amount of new awesome effects!"

What exactly are 'effects'? Are they card tricks? Or flourishes like color changes, etc..

Thanks


Effects are simply tricks, card tricks, the end result, sort of like the punchline of a joke. I place an 8 of diamonds in your hands, when you look at the card again, it has changed into a 10 of hearts. The amazement you feel at the moment is the "effect." You might not be ready for CARD ZONES. It is filled with "knuckle busting" card effects. Knuckle busting means not easy stuff.
Paul
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The word "effect" is interchangeable with "trick" in magic talk. With the performance of a magic trick you create a magical "effect". It is a better word than "trick" which suggests trickery before uou start.

As Gilbreath76 said, Ninja, at this point "Card Zones" is NOT the book for you.
A better Peter Duffie book might be "Effortless Card Magic".

Paul.
Gary
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Effect - polite or upmarket terminology for trick.
"I can see clearly now, the brain has gone"
- Anon
ninja
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I am actually searching for "knuckle-busting" card-handling material.

Thank you both for this indication. By Forces Unseen will be one of my next purchases, alongside The Card Magic of LePaul. I am considering Modus Operandi by Jack Carpenter.. is this knuckle-busting as well?

Thanks
Euan
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I wouldn't say Card Zones is knuckle busting it's more intermediate. Duffie/Sadowitz don't do knuckle busting magic, that's part of the beauty of thier work.


Effect: how a layman sees a trick.
Method: how a magician sees a trick.


Smile
Paul
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re;
"I am actually searching for "knuckle-busting" card-handling material."

Does this mean you are more interested in methods than effects? Smile

Paul.
ninja
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Effects.

I believe in general, that when sleight of hand is used for card tricks, the effects are usually more enjoyable for an audience.

I know this isn't always the case, but I think more often than not it is. Think Bob Longe. ;D

I'd like to hear other opinions
PatUmphrey
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I suggest reading the "gimmicks vs. sleights" thread.

If you are comparing sleight of hand magic to some of those lame tricks you see in basic self-working books, then I would have to agree. Yes, sleight of hand magic is more impressive in this comparison.

In gneral, I would say that it entirely depends on what routine, how good the sleights are, several factors.

They are all tools that we use as magicians, and they should be used properly just like any other tool.

I.E. using a glide to do some contrived and ugly force is like using a saw to pound in a nail.

IMHO, as usual.
I am off on another tangent again, as usual.


Pat
“And you’ve got a perfectly logical reason for showing the cards like this” -Harry Lorayne

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harris
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Jack Carpenter's stuff reads awesome.

I picked it up a few years ago. Perhaps I need to look at it again. At the time it was beyond my ability.(at least I thought it was)


The EFFECT is everything. Ingredients such as sleights,"self working"(no such thing IMHO), props (whether from a "magic shop" or garage sale),emotions
(love, humor, mystery) will lead your spectators to experience to the effect.

It is said that the effect should be able to be put into one sentence.


Connect with your audience.

Harris Smile
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
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RandyWakeman
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Quote:
On 2002-08-13 08:48, ninja wrote:
Effects.

I believe in general, that when sleight of hand is used for card tricks, the effects are usually more enjoyable for an audience.

I'd like to hear other opinions


Of course not. Using sleights automatically guarantees nothing. Is there any reason for an audience to "enjoy" Triumph more than "Cheek-to-Cheek?"
S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2002-08-13 08:48, ninja wrote:
Effects.

I believe in general, that when sleight of hand is used for card tricks, the effects are usually more enjoyable for an audience.


At 43 (OK, OK, almost 44; sheesh!) I'm not all that interested in learning knuckle-busting sleights. I'll learn a new sleight if I need it for an effect I really want to perform, but I won't learn a sleight just to acquire a new sleight. The views of more, ahem, youthful practitioners may differ, as they should.

That said, I find that many of my best effects--in the sense of getting the strongest reaction from a lay audience--are sleight-light or sleightless.

As a simple example, I perform Fogel's Triple Prediction (from Burger's Mastering the Art of Magic) using a presentation which involves dog-parks (where the dogs run around off-leash), white gloves, and personality transfer. (Think about it.) I was at a Mardi Gras party recently where one of the guests dragged a friend across the room to me and said (to me) "Show him the one where he deals three poker hands" and (to him) "You're not going to believe this!" Why was the reaction so strong? Because the effect wasn't about playing cards, it was about the spectator. Sometimes a soupcon of subtlety is worth more than the greatest sleight.

Keep working on the sleights, but make your presentations about the spectators, and the reactions will improve ten-fold.
ninja
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I understand that presentation and effect are most important of all, it's just that most of the card tricks that I have seen that are considered by me to have an amazing effect require a few sleight of hand maneouvers. Usually, it's these tricks that have much better effects than any of the self-working ones.

If anyone knows of any AWESOME self-working feats, I would like to be referred. The best I have is Bob Longe... so you can see where I'm coming from here. I have Hugard's books, and will take a glance at them.

Thanks.
PatUmphrey
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Paul Cummins published some good stuff in a manuscript, I believe it is called ACME. I would suggest contacting him and purchasing a copy.
“And you’ve got a perfectly logical reason for showing the cards like this” -Harry Lorayne

“Paging Mr. Herman” –Rafael Benetar
S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2002-08-13 11:57, ninja wrote:

If anyone knows of any AWESOME self-working feats, I would like to be referred.


I already mentioned Fogel's Triple Prediction in Burger's Mastering the Art of Magic. Daryl's Dream a Card, Any Card (Magic for Dummies, and, likely, elsewhere) is virtually identical in method: completely sleightless. Lorayne's Lazy Man's Card Trick (Close-Up Card Magic) is another; if you've memorized a stack (say, Aronson's), it's even more incredible. Also try Lorayne's Stop!, same book.

For sleight-light stunners, try Bannon's Vicious Rumors and Timely Departure in his Smoke and Mirrors.
Lance Pierce
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Quote:
On 2002-08-13 08:48, ninja wrote:
Effects.

I believe in general, that when sleight of hand is used for card tricks, the effects are usually more enjoyable for an audience.

I know this isn't always the case, but I think more often than not it is. Think Bob Longe. ;D

I'd like to hear other opinions



What I've noticed is that people who've been in magic for a while and have developed an understanding of magical ways will over time acquire a large arsenal of techniques that they have at their disposal…and tend to rely on them less and less. As they move further into the art, they begin to really comprehend that personal manner, management, and presentation (not "presentation" as in a script or plot line, but "presentation" as in how you present yourself and your material) are paramount.

It's been said that self-working effects are the very hardest to perform, and I've found that the ones who really perform the self-working effects the best are those who are the most accomplished at technique and presentation. The ones who really do a god-awful job of performing self-working effects are those who think that self-working effects are…well…self-working.

Many of the "masters" of today and yesterday seemed to move into a phase of their thinking where they were more intrigued by subtlety and subterfuge than moves and mechanics. Does this mean that they stopped doing sleights altogether? Hardly. It means that rather than sleights being at the forefront of their thinking, the moves took their place in harmony with the other, more important factors of magical performance.


TCR
Paul
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Quote:
On 2002-08-13 08:48, ninja wrote:
Effects.

I believe in general, that when sleight of hand is used for card tricks, the effects are usually more enjoyable for an audience.

I know this isn't always the case, but I think more often than not it is. Think Bob Longe. ;D

I'd like to hear other opinions


You believe wrong.
A good performer mixes both type of effects.
You might be surprised how many "expert" card magicians fool others with simple methods. Usually because it is totally unexpected of them.

For strong, few or no sleight card effects check out Stewart James' material.

At one time one of my favourite card to card case routines was a no sleight Marlo version.

Come to think of it, I'm foolish for telling you this. lol.

Paul.
Stephen Long
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There are a few "self-workers" out there that are absolutely baffling.
(I use the quotation marks because I share TCR's view that no effect is self-working).

One of the reasons "self-workers" can appear to be so miraculous is because of the lack of sleights.
By that I mean that it appears as though there could have been no possible manipulation of the cards on the part of the performer.

"The card expert commands the respect of others because, apparently, he does not manipulate the cards."
-- Huggard (?)


Quote:
On 2002-08-13 11:57, ninja wrote:

If anyone knows of any AWESOME self-working feats, I would like to be referred.


'T'would be my pleasure, ninja.
I refer you to my favourite ever self-worker, "Mindbender" by John Clark.
It can be found in Ortiz's "Darwin Ortiz at the Card Table".
(Any who own this book, but have overlooked this gem should very seriously consider reading up on it.)

Stephen
:coolspot:
Hello.
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