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pikacrd Veteran user Florida 387 Posts |
I do not work for tips at all so I am not qualified to give advice on how to get a tip, but once when I was at a restaurant in Orlando I had a magician approach my table with two photos one in his right hand and one in his left they were wallet sized photos of his kids, and no I do not mean goats. He laid the photos down on the outside corners of the table looked up at me and said something like “These are my kids aren’t they great? Now that you know who I am working for please take a card”. I thought it was funny in a twisted kind of way, but at the same time I understood exactly what he was getting at and it did not make me feel good as a spectator I felt obligated to give this guy a tip even before he started his first trick.
I would say that this is probably not the method that you want to go with. I think that if I were going to work for tips I would somehow work a borrowed bill routine into the mix and when done with it I would leave it out on the table and wait to see what happens after I have done the remainder of my table side act. Obviously this takes some tact so that you do not come off looking as if you can’t wait for them to hand you the bill and say that it is yours. You do not want to end up with an uncomfortable pause at the end of your time at the table while you wait for them to pony up the dough. As it has already been said have a great time with the guests present them with great magic and be as polite as you can with some very gentle hints you will get the tips if that is what you are working for.
“Indubitably, Magic is one of the subtlest and most difficult of the sciences and arts. There is more opportunity for errors of comprehension, judgment and practice than in any other branch of physics”. William S. Burroughs 1914-1997 American Writer
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Mike Wild Inner circle NY, PA, TX, MA, FL, NC 1290 Posts |
RE: "When someone offers a tip, I'd much rather refuse the tip, but ask the tipper to take one of my business cards and let me put him/her on my mailing list!"
I guess I'll always be off on my own with the on-going, never-ending issue of tips vs salary. I'm a bartender who does magic... I make my living on my tips, as most bartenders do. I get much better tips because of the integration of magic and entertainment into the normal pouring of drinks and other associated bar tending duties. That's fine... I can live with being different and not seeing tips as a bad thing that cheapens our art and destroys our morals... However, Asking for someone's mailing address so you can potentially pepper them with junk mail, after refusing to accept the gratuity that they have freely offered to you for providing them with entertainment is in bad taste (IMO). This is how it comes off to me.... "Oh... a tip. How quaint, however I'm far above you and your money. I'll tell you what I will take though... I'll take your address for my mailing list. When something good comes up, I'll let you know..." How does that sound to the rest of you? It sounds like a pompus ass with a swelled head and messed up priorities to me. (Not directed at you Barry, just making a general example). Anyway... the rest of you can refuse tips if you so choose. That leaves more money in people's pockets for when they come to see me. Mike |
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pikacrd Veteran user Florida 387 Posts |
Mike,
I am not so sure if anyone of the people who have commented are saying that they are above tips, I think what is being said is that as a paid performer they do not expect to receive tips from the clientele. This issue has been discussed several times here in the Café as well has been covered by books DVD’s and videos. It is my opinion as someone who does not work for tips that more negative issues can be avoided by not accepting tips than the other way around. Most of this stems from wait staff that see a magician as competition when it comes to the issue of tips and not someone who can help them garner greater tips. I can understand this because my wife has worked as a server in the past and her hourly wages were much lower than the minimum wage because of the fact that she did receive tips. With that in mind she worked her butt off to make the tips that she got. I know that when I am working in a restaurant I do everything that I can to get the wait staff on my side because I want there assistance in making sure that the management wants to keep me around, I can work harder and better than anyone on the staff and do a great job with the customers but if the staff ends up having an issue with me and what they feel as competition for tips they can make it very hard on management when making a decision regarding keeping me on or not. The restaurant needs wait staff they do not need a magician. I am also paid at a much higher rate than what ever I would make in tips for an hours worth of work at a restaurant so this plays into that thinking as well. As far as being above tips nope I have worked on the street in the past and passed the hat in attempts to get tips so no I for one do not feel that I am above tips at all, I just do not work for them in a restaurant environment. I think that a lot of the restaurant magicians that participate in these conversations will say similar things when it comes to why they do not accept tips when working at a restaurant. There is another school of thought regarding tips one that I do not necessarily subscribe to and that is the magician who looks at a tip as an insult these people are few and far between but from what I have experienced when getting to know one of these magicians is that they feel that what they do is worth more than the $5 tip that you gave them when they just spent 10 minutes at your table. I guess if you are of this breed and you do the math the thinking is that you are only worth $30 an hour and that is taken as an insult, the problem is that of the ones that I have run into that are of this thinking type the truth is that they are only worth $30 an hour if that. All in all with all of that said, I think that you are in the best position in the restaurant you can perform for your audience and accept the tips while you are making your living working as a bartender. It is kind of the best of both worlds situation. Cheers, Kris
“Indubitably, Magic is one of the subtlest and most difficult of the sciences and arts. There is more opportunity for errors of comprehension, judgment and practice than in any other branch of physics”. William S. Burroughs 1914-1997 American Writer
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Mike Wild Inner circle NY, PA, TX, MA, FL, NC 1290 Posts |
I've heard about that strange relationship that magicians and servers are supposed to have with each other, i.e., that servers don't like magicians, and think that magicians cut into their tips. I've never experienced it myself, but I've also done very little walk around in restaurants. I'm a bar guy, and will remain so for the very reason that you mentioned Kris... it's the best of both (all) worlds.
I have vigorously engaged in the tips debate many times here and elsewhere, and have simply heard too many magicians (often times novices or hobbiests) talk about the shame and insult of tipping, and theorize that working for tips lowers the artistic level of magic in general, etc, etc. It simply is not true. I will agree that there are certain situations that can arise in a tipping scenario that would not if the magician were taking a salary instead, however, I've found that a good deal of these situations would arise in any event, due to the magician's personality or lack there of, and due to a lack of communication and people skills. I really do have it made. I keep the drinks going for the servers' tables, so they're on my side. I serve the customers at the bar, so they like me. I perform magic pretty much when and how I want to, which entertains (hopefully) everyone and makes me happy. And I have a nice amount in my glass jar at the end of a night to show for it all. Win / Win scenario if you ask me. Mike |
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Pete W. New user Coffeyville, KS 80 Posts |
A sentiment that I'm sure "Mike Wild" will agree....
Customers tip because they want to. Not accepting a tip is pure insult....regardless of your payment status. A tip is a gift. Don't return it to the giver or act as if you don't want it. Accept wholeheartedly. It's a win-win situation! But as mentioned early on, don't expect it. That's the best assurance that you will actually get tipped.
"Amatuers perform different tricks for the same people. Professionals perform the same tricks for different people."...Al Goshman
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Mike Wild Inner circle NY, PA, TX, MA, FL, NC 1290 Posts |
Indeed I do agree. The only exception I can think of relates to venue. In my daytime life I'm an IT Manager for a medium-sized company. We are supporters and sponsors of our local United Way chapter, and some of us are even board members. In that capacity, I volunteer several times a year to perform at United Way functions. I've been offered gratuities at some of these events that I politely refuse, asking that they give the money to the cause at hand, typically Big Brothers & Big Sisters, the Alcoholism Council, or the Battered Woman's Shelter.
In these cases I don't think the refusal of the money is taken as an insult... I hope not anyway. Mike |
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kihei kid Inner circle Dog House 1039 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-01-17 22:05, tejoal wrote: I agree. Quote:
People come to a restaraunt to eat, they're already counting how much money this is going to cost them. Sad but true in some circumstances. Being a bartender in a restaurant there is a saying in our business "if you can't afford to go out stay at home." When you come into the place I work you will get top notch service from me for a few reasons. A) Because it is my nature. B) The business I'm in demands it. C) I work for tips not the federally mandated minimum wage. A perfect example happened to me just last night, A couple came in with a $10.00 coupon we put out. When they sat at the bar I work at they asked me for the menu and about drink prices then said "we don't have any money". That's right. They came in to use a $10.00 coupon right to the penny (actually they were .50 cents short as it turned out!) and pi** on everybody else including the foodrunner I tip out at the end of the night. It still amazes me to this day how completely oblivious some folks are.
In loving memory of Hughie Thomasson 1952-2007.
You brought something beautiful to this world, you touched my heart, my soul and my life. You will be greatly missed. Until we meet again “my old friend”. |
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welsha New user 11 Posts |
From my experience with taxi drivers and delivery men, I can tell when they expect a tip. So I feel reluctant to give them one. So I agree, don't expect and you should receive.
alex welsh |
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Scott Wells Inner circle Houston, TX 1025 Posts |
Quote:
On 2004-12-24 22:34, majimagic wrote: I applaud all of the above replies to the original question here that started this thread; however, I don't know that we have really answered what I "think" is the intended question. I "believe" he wants to know what specific tricks will "GTFM", as Doc Eason would say. Look at how he asks for money at the end of his show then does the "$100 Bill-on-Ceiling Through Fan" trick. Is it wrong to blatantly ask for money like that after your show? I'm sure someone will respond to that. Some have suggested using dollar bill (or bank note) tricks because when money is on the table, then they are more likely to leave it with you. For example, Card Warp with a bill, borrowing three bills and wadding them into balls for use in cups and balls, etc. I have heard of some magicians who mangle, moisten, mutilate or otherwise destroy a volunteer's bill then offer it back in that condition. I think that's deplorable and would suggest that you offer to replace it with a replacement bill. They would be more likely then to just let you keep the mangled bill. But when using borrowed bills, the money is already out there so there is no fumbling or reaching into their pockets to tip you after your performance. They are more likely to let you keep it. On that note and a little off topic, it reminds me of what I call the "Tyrannosaurus Rex Syndrome". When the bill for the evening's meal/drinks is brought out by the server, it seems that suddenly everyone's arm is too short to reach for it. I have found something that works extremely well for me. As you are preparing for your last trick, be sure to let your audience know it. They need to know that you are preparing to leave their table. First ask to make sure that they have been having a great time and if they have been enjoying the magic performance. Receiving affirmations, then is a good time to remind them to tell the management on the way out so they can be assured that they will see you again the next time they come in. Then announce that you sincerely appreciate their time and that if they will allow, then you would like to show them "one more trick." That way, they will have time to reach for their wallets. If you just dive into your last trick and walk away, it leaves them hollow. They did not have a chance to fully show their appreciation. They may have to chase you down to give you a tip (that does occasionally happen, which is not a bad thing. It lets the patrons at the then-current table where you are working know that you accept tips and that everyone else is tipping you). Also, if at the end of that last trick you have a bunch of stuff on the table or your close-up pad (i.e. final loads from cups and balls), then it will take a while for you to gather them up, put them in your pockets and reset for the next table. That could leave a little "uncomfortable" time when they can go to their pockets and give you a gratuity if they are so inclined. It should go without saying, though I guess I must, that your final trick at their table should be a real killer. Oh, one other thing, as someone else mentioned above, if you leave them with something, regardless of how inexpensive it might be (a balloon doggie, pearl poodle, even a signed playing card), then they might feel as if they owe you something material for the material gift you gave them. Now, following the thread of other thoughts provided here, let me leave you with this food for thought... It's hard to put value on art. When you go to a "free" museum where you are encouraged to leave a "donation", how much do you pay for the esoteric experience of transient pleasure of the eye and brain? So, how much a patron gives you or doesn't give you is not necessarily a reflection on your performance being good or bad (though it might be). It is usually just a reflection of their personal value of art. yours, Scott
"A magician who isn't working is only fooling himself." - Scott Wells, M.I.M.C. with Gold Star
The Magic Word podcast: http://themagicwordpodcast.com Listen to convention coverage, interviews with magicians, pictures, videos and more. Magic Inspirations website for all things Banachek: www.magicinspirations.net |
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Review King Eternal Order 14446 Posts |
Eason worked in a resort town. The people that came to the Tower had money. It was quite appropriate, behind the bar, to work for tips and Doc did it with absolute class.
"Of all words of tongue and pen,
the saddest are, "It might have been" ..........John Greenleaf Whittier |
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Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
I once worked largely for tips in a number of resturants doing table hopping. First I found that if the resturant had a history of magicians doing table hopping the tips were good and easy to get. If it was a resturant where the owner or some resident magician always did magic, they were slim and hard to come by. So where ur performing has a lot to do with it. Many people don't realize that a tip is expected. Why, as noted by others above, you should negotiate a reasonable salary up front. I was once told "ask for some money to use in the trick, vanish it and don't give it back". Tried that, will never do that again! I learned to size up tables, I looked for someone who was obviously trying to entertain guests, possibly a business man entertaining a client. I would do a good show, making sure the client or guest was entertained. The tip did not always come at the time of the performance, often the cashier or waiter would bring it to me when the guest left and paid up. So learn to read ur audience. If they look like they want to be left alone to discuss business or serious talk, don't bother them. If they look like a family just out for dinner, make a quick trick and move on to more fertile grounds for tips. Experience will quickly help you identify potential tippers from the masses. Do nice entertaining magic for the masses, but don't spend a lot of time. For the potential tippers, spend time and play up big to their guests.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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Doc Eason V.I.P. Aspen Colorado 429 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-03-16 22:04, MagicChris wrote: EXACTLY.... I really don’t choose to weigh in on this issue.. it is beaten to death... only to say that the rules that work in Aspen and Snowmass Colorado ...and the way I worked it was in a bar that was set up for magic, and they knew what to expect going in, and I worked it to build toward the pitch...these conditions are different than almost any other spot in the world... and they are different from most of the situations in this thread. So while I am flattered that my name is tossed around, in this discussion the way that I work(ed) * really shouldn’t be used as a benchmark, yardstick or rationale for getting tips in general. *[the Tower is closed]
Doc Eason’s Rocky Mountain Magic
PO Box 50 / Basalt CO 81621 doc@doceason.com http://doceason.com http://doceasonmagicshop.com |
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Scott Wells Inner circle Houston, TX 1025 Posts |
Doc,
That reminds me...did Tom Mullica work for tips at the Tom Foolery? That, too, was a magic bar, but it didn't build up to the pitch like your show. I remember paying a fee at the front door to come in and watch the show, so I don't think Tom took tips since patrons had already paid. I don't remember anyone tipping him, though some may have. Is my memory on that right or fuzzy? And while we're on it, how did you work out tips with Flash or Speed or whatever his name was who was the bartender who worked with you? yours, Scott
"A magician who isn't working is only fooling himself." - Scott Wells, M.I.M.C. with Gold Star
The Magic Word podcast: http://themagicwordpodcast.com Listen to convention coverage, interviews with magicians, pictures, videos and more. Magic Inspirations website for all things Banachek: www.magicinspirations.net |
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Doc Eason V.I.P. Aspen Colorado 429 Posts |
No Tom did not work for tips... he charged a cover and that was it...
Zoom is the guy you are talking about... We pretty m,uch split tips ... One of the most important pieces of info for someone working in a bar is to keep your back up guy happy... now if someone gives you that secret handshake with a bill in it... that went straight in the pocket but otherwise we pretty much split the tips... thereby building that ever important comradery. doc
Doc Eason’s Rocky Mountain Magic
PO Box 50 / Basalt CO 81621 doc@doceason.com http://doceason.com http://doceasonmagicshop.com |
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enigmo-online New user Germany 1 Post |
I work in a german retaurant - owner pays.
But at least I want to get some tips. Here´s my way to get Tips from almost every Table. Before the announced last Trick I tell the people, that I forgot my magic book at the table before. I just tell them that I will be back in a second. I pick up the book at the last tabe (it is a little Book, where the people can write in something, if they enjoyed the Show). Back at the Table I ask them to write some nice words for me into the book and open it. In this time, I let a 5 Euro (e.g. 5 Dollar-Bill) fall out of the book and say something like "oh, that´s nice" - and put the Bill into my pocket. The book I lay down at the Table. I perform the last trick and ask the people on the Table to write some nice Words into my book, I would take it back a bit later - and leave the table. I normally have only to put the first bill into the book - after that, the people fill the bills int the book - and if not, I have some nice words in my book. it works for me and I had no table where peole were angry about that. I apologise for my bad english oliver |
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kinesis Inner circle Scotland, surrounded by 2708 Posts |
MAJIMAGIC - Back to your original question. Make sure you are getting paid well enough that you don't need to do tricks aimed at getting tips from people. Then make sure you work hard enough to deserve what you're getting paid. Then, if you do get tips, you've earned them fair and square.
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Comet Loyal user 235 Posts |
Quote:
On 2004-12-26 10:30, Kennedy wrote I learned a Long time ago to NOT refuse a tip. it's easy to insult someone by refusing a tip. Remember it may be a man on a date and offering a tip makes him look good. It also could be a fellow magician who has enough respect for you as a performer to compliment you instead of grabbing the deck and doing a trick himself. I will usually tip a fellow magician if I am in a place where he/she's working. If you don't feel right takeing a tip then spread it around to the servers. They'll like you for it and having them on your side is one of the BEST things you could do in a restaurant setting. best advice was given in your first replay though I must agree. do a good job and don't expect a tip. ENJOY!! Joe Comet |
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