CreativeCoach,
Thanks for the insightful post. I agree with you wholeheartedly. I really want to try to educate people to recognize these products for what they are. Perhaps my time is wasted trying, sometimes I can't help myself.
Thanks again.

DVA,

Let's be careful when we generalize "these products." I believe there are also some extremely good products out there. We have to be careful not to group all programs into the "Dave Dee" category.

You're correct there are some programs out there that are worth the money.
The "These products" I mention only refer to products that make the claims Dave Dee's products do. Specifically "Get rich quick using my plan it's easy and foolproof as long as you follow my instructions."
Sorry for the confusion.

Creative coach: great post! I think that you have hit on something very important when you mention all the people who want to quit their 9-5s and do magic full time. These are the dreams Dee has profited from!

Not unlike the Amway guys, or the latest Pyramid-style business, or the realestate "get rich quick" schemes, these programs prey on people's deepest desires. The formula is always the same: I was broke, hated my life, I was in debt, etc BUT THEN, I discovered this EASY SYSTEM, and NOW I'm making so much money I can't count it all, doing what I love, living my dreams! Send me YOUR money and I'll show you how I did it!


then, quickly, in small print,


...your results may vary. I haven't really made as much money using this system as I claim. This system is almost exaclty like twenty more already avaliable. This business burns me out. Claims regarding my expertise may be exagerated or out-right lies. Send your money now!

You're right. It's more about selling the dream than it is about selling the soap (in Amway's case anyway).

I once attended a "business opportunity presentation" put on by a guy selling long distance service. He spoke for over an hour, painting a very rosey picture of how much money could be made easily and quickly following his "system."

When he finished, I approached him to get more specific information. "You talk about how much money you can make," I inquired, "but what about your expenses? What does it cost you to run your business?"

"Oh nothing," came the reply, "I have no product, it's long distance service."

"Pardon me," I replied, "I own my own business, and I know that every business has overhead. For example, I understand that you drove 200 miles to be here tonight. Certainly your travel exenses are deductable."

"Oh yes," he exclaimed, "everything is deductable, I can write off everything!"

Well, which is it...you can't have it both ways. When selling the system, the most optimistic picture is painted, but the reality is usually quite different.

The biggest problem I have with anyone selling a "system for success" is that they often do not give the buyer a clear vision of the realities of the business. Anyone who claims you can get rich easily performing magic is not being honest.

Building a successful practice as a professional magician (or Amway salesperson for that matter) takes hard work and several years - at least five years to get any business off the ground.

That's the reality... the trouble is...we magicians prefer the illusion!

Jim - well said!

[quote]On 2005-01-21 07:10, Creative Coach wrote:
DVD-
doing 685 shows a yr in them! Among the local performers it was, Dave Who?

Maby he uses a stage name like Dave Behave or My Ballon dude or something
I'm not disagreeing with you but one of the things he teaches as well as everyone else is to have different marketing materials for each market I would assume Dave Dee is his marketing magic stage name but for motivational talks perhaps he uses a different name.

David

His real name is David Dipietro hence the stage name Dave Dee. That is his performing name. If he really was as successful as he says why would he use a secret Marketing Name that would only apply if what he said about his success wasn't true. Oops, maybe your right David.

Martin

Magic Pirate,
Nope! Used Dave Dee for parties. I still stand by my post. He's a Magical Marketeer who sells a dream. Like many have said your ultimate success is up to YOU! Your success or failure lies in YOUR hands. But is he a REAL performer? Have you ever seen his "I Love To Read" video? Need I say more?

As a REAL professional speaker I can tell you I have consulted with several people who bought his speaking program and found it lacking. There is a LOT more to becoming a successful speaker. It's not the Instant Success business its portrayed to be. Listen to professionals like Jim Snack (Another REAL professional speaker) Get some books such as Money Talks by Alan Weiss and learn from the pros who earn their income from speaking!

As for all of the influx of GET RICH QUICK WITHOUT REALLY TRYING manuals.... Buyer beware!

I'm gonna do a google searches on David Dipietro

Creative Coach
I agree with you (but he sounded nice on the phone)

DW

I must add that I have purchased a Dave Dee product. I wanted to see how he structured a school show and his marketing advice. I also purchased admission to the Success in Magic seminar at the last Kidabra as well as the conference and the Marketing day. Immediately after attending the Success in Magic seminar I was unhappy. I was unhappy because they did not give me any advice on how to get things together by tomorrow so that I could retire rich in two years. I settled down and have begun to work on the things they taught there. The seminar was one of the most beneficial investments that I have made. What they taught will help me achieve what I want for many years as long as I follow the advice and take the time it deserves to do it right. Am I saying that the Dave Dee thing was a bad investment for me? No, it was not. It served its purpose as well. I do agree with the others when they say to check things out and talk to as many experts as you can to find out as best as you can prior to purchasing.

Right! Success in Magic was a great investment. Steve Hart, Steve Taylor, BJ Hickman and Jim Snack are all working pros. What you saw shared there was the real deal! Notice no one said "Instant Success!" but rather laid out a truthful plan to long term success. KidAbra was a lot of fun this yr. It was my 3rd lecture there. Met a lot of really nice people this yr.

Basically, for me, it comes down to this. I made my money back from Dave's course the FIRST MONTH. I can't say that about Jim's course (although I do think its a quality product.)

Like I posted some people like Dave's stuff. People are at different points in their careers. People have different tastes, otherwise Baskin Robbins wouldn't make 31 flavors of ice cream!

Hi there -

Just a small clarification to Popo's and Creative Coach's post.

As I understand it, "Success in Magic" is Jim Snack's product, but was not the name of the seminar right before KidAbra.

The "Magic Success Seminar" is the school assembly seminar that those 4 presenters (Steve Hart, Steve Taylor, BJ Hickman and Jim Snack) did together, right before KidAbra (and also at a few other locations before that). This is also now available as a product, as a set of DVDs / lecture notes.

Just wanted to clear up any confusion. You may want to know this differentiation if you go looking to buy one of the two different products. If you bought "Success in Magic" you won't get information by all 4 of those presenters, and you get different information.

Is that right, Jim?

- Donald

Your are correct Donald.

The Magic Success Seminar focused on targeting school shows and included myself, Steve Hart, BJ Hickman and Steve Taylor. We now offer the 9 DVD set at http://www.MagicSuccessSeminars.com

My Success in Magic Course is a more general business building course for magicians. The website for that is http://www.success-in-magic.com

Thanks for clarifying that.
Jim

After I read all of everyone post I only want to say..IT'S A TRICKY BUSINESS!
Got it?

Silapmata,

I'm wondering if YOU got it?

G.

My how a little research can put Dave Dee into perspective.

From his magic site http://www.davedee.com/uis.htm you'll find this:



From the site originally posted with this thread you find this.



He buries himself with his own words. Seems to have a different story based on what market he wants to sell too. I guess that is okay if you are into that sort of thing, but what about integrity.

Martin

Just found this testimonial Dave Dee gave to Dan Kennedy:



Just so you know David Dipietro is Dave Dee. He seems to have a totally different take on Just Over Broke then I have.

Martin

There is no integrity.

I wish more magicians were aware of this thread.