The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Silk & Silver--Where can I learn this? (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
richgerb86
View Profile
Loyal user
Reading, Pa.
204 Posts

Profile of richgerb86
I looking to learn Vernon's Silk & Silver routine. I have been unable to find the book that it in (The Lost Inner Secrets). Are there any other resources for this routine? I have Palms of Steel vol 1, but the routine is not fully explained, it is suggested that you learn it from the book. Curtis Kam's version is great, after seeing him do it his lecture really made me want to learn this effect.
Thanks in advance for all help & advice.
phread
View Profile
Elite user
md
486 Posts

Profile of phread
Look at pos 1 again...curtis does show how he changed the original to make it flow better.
dug
Deckless Wonder
richgerb86
View Profile
Loyal user
Reading, Pa.
204 Posts

Profile of richgerb86
He does not go into detail of the folding sequences, he states that they are described very well in the book.
Thanks for the suggestion.
DwightPA
View Profile
Regular user
Dwight Powell
113 Posts

Profile of DwightPA
Hi, Rich.

Vernon's Silk & Silver can be found on Revelations V5 & 6. Vernon shows a couple of basics but professes not to remember the routine. Ammar performs it and demonstrates the moves. If you don't have the video, give me a call.

Dwight
richgerb86
View Profile
Loyal user
Reading, Pa.
204 Posts

Profile of richgerb86
Thanks Dwight, I'll check out the DVD's. I have been wanting to buy them anyway.
Thanks you to everyone for their help.
RS1963
View Profile
Inner circle
2720 Posts

Profile of RS1963
Sorry re read original post and My post was not of much help so never mind.
GeorgeSantos
View Profile
Inner circle
San Diego, CA
1106 Posts

Profile of GeorgeSantos
Is this similar to David Roth's COins and Silk?
"David Roth is the greatest coin manipulator in the entire world.."

-Dai Vernon "The Professor"


I AM A FILIPINO MAGICIAN
Paul Sherman
View Profile
Inner circle
Arlington, VA
1511 Posts

Profile of Paul Sherman
The effect is that four coins are wrapped in a silk and then vanish. Then, one at a time, they're plucked from the air and thrown into a bag made from the silk. The final coin isn't reproduced by the magician, but is thrown invisibly (but audibly) into the bag by the spectator.

Curtis has added a second phase where the coins penetrate the silk, a third (very amusing) phase where one of the coins changes into a chinese coin and jumps around magically, and a finale that's just stunning (with a KILLER tagline).

Paul
"The finished card expert considers nothing too trivial that in any way contributes to his success..." Erdnase



some youtube videos
Werner G. Seitz
View Profile
Inner circle
3131 Posts

Profile of Werner G. Seitz
Well, Fred Kaps had 'his' own variation all his life in his stage-act.
The effect is exactly as described above by Paul Sherman, the handling flawless.

He changed a lot of routines during the years, but that one always stayed in his act..
DV himslef did teach it to FK and he made his own handling variations.
Anybody want to se the real master of this doing that effect, get his DVD, *Seeing is believing*
Learn a few things well.....this life is not long enough to do everything.....

( Words of wisdom from Albert Goshman ...it paid off for him - it might
as well for YOU!!!- My own magic is styled after that motto... Smile )
GaMBiT_101
View Profile
Regular user
Adelaide
145 Posts

Profile of GaMBiT_101
Take a look at one of the Inner secrets videos, where you can see Bruce Cervon teach it. I would tell you which tape, but I'm too lazy to look right now.
"Being able to do tricks, doesn't mean you're able to be Entertaining!"
Werner G. Seitz
View Profile
Inner circle
3131 Posts

Profile of Werner G. Seitz
Quote:
On 2005-03-28 21:19, GaMBiT_101 wrote:
... where you can see Bruce Cervon teach it.
I always enjoyed seeing Bruce Cervon do anything he's very very good.
Nevertheless if one wants really to enjoy the best handling re this, one has to se Fred Kaps do it..JMHO..and I've seen him doing it life so many times, speaking ofon TV-appearnaces where he did it, way back to the midt 1960s or so..
Learn a few things well.....this life is not long enough to do everything.....

( Words of wisdom from Albert Goshman ...it paid off for him - it might
as well for YOU!!!- My own magic is styled after that motto... Smile )
Vraagaard
View Profile
Inner circle
Copenhagen, Denmark
1353 Posts

Profile of Vraagaard
I find the routine fairly good explained on the Dai Vernon revelation tapes. Vernon explains the transfers and Michael Ammar explains some finepoints.

Chris Kenner also has a variation in his book "Totally Out Of Control", just to add another example of how this can be done. Chris Kenners method steals/vanishes the coins out of the silk without a single noise. However, I prefer the Dai Vernon routine, and would love to see Fred Kaps version/handling and presentation.

This puzzles my mind. Many of us constantly chase new inventions, new methods, however, Fred Kaps kept this routine in his repertoire "forever", which suggests to me, go to the old suitcase, find the pearls, polish them, make them shine and stick with them, if the audience shines with you. Why am I constantly learning new coins across routines - well to find the best of course. But maybe the best - only becomes the best if I decide to simply concentrate on one and finetune this to perfection in both handling and presentation. And Dai Vernons routine used by Fred Kaps is clearly a thing of beauty - wonder why Dai Vernon didn't use it that much himself.

There is a danger in these forums. You constantly becomes inspired to chase new routines - it take some disciplin.
Feral Chorus
View Profile
Elite user
CA
480 Posts

Profile of Feral Chorus
Based on Paul's and Werner's descriptions, Fred Kaps' routine is performed and explained on Cellini's DVD, Magic That Can Be Performed Anywhere. The routine is titled (appropriately enough) Fred Kaps' Vanish and Recovery of Four Coins. A very good DVD by the way.
Werner G. Seitz
View Profile
Inner circle
3131 Posts

Profile of Werner G. Seitz
Quote:
On 2005-03-29 10:22, Feral Chorus wrote:
Based on Paul's and Werner's descriptions, Fred Kaps' routine is performed and explained on Cellini's DVD, Magic That Can Be Performed Anywhere.
Nothing could be more wrong..what Celli shows (I do have all his DVDs) is Cellini's handling of that routine and there is absolutely zero similarity to the way Fred Kaps did it!!

This doesn't mean Cellini does it badly, he has actually adapted a very interesting vanish of the coins (Eddie Joseph) but it is misinformation to tell ppl Fred Kaps' routine is explained in Cellini's DVD!!!
NOTHING Cellini does is the way FK did it, and Cellini does mention so himself..what is common is soley the effect!
Learn a few things well.....this life is not long enough to do everything.....

( Words of wisdom from Albert Goshman ...it paid off for him - it might
as well for YOU!!!- My own magic is styled after that motto... Smile )
Feral Chorus
View Profile
Elite user
CA
480 Posts

Profile of Feral Chorus
Werner,

Yes, yes, yes, and yes, you are correct and I should have been clearer. IIRC, Cellini was inspired by and developed his routine after seeing a Kaps performance on tape. Thanks for pointing out (forcefully, LOL) my error.
JBSmith1978
View Profile
Veteran user
NY
368 Posts

Profile of JBSmith1978
Any info on how to obtain the Kaps DVD? Also Palms of Steel #1.

I'm working on a version myself and I'd like to have all the versions available to work off of.

Best
Ray Haining
View Profile
Inner circle
Hot Springs, AR
1891 Posts

Profile of Ray Haining
Tom Stone's DVD, "Caught on Tape," contains a version titled "A Toast for Charon." I think it was inspired by the Vernon routine.
Ray Haining
View Profile
Inner circle
Hot Springs, AR
1891 Posts

Profile of Ray Haining
Quote:
On Mar 28, 2005, GaMBiT_101 wrote:
Take a look at one of the Inner secrets videos, where you can see Bruce Cervon teach it. I would tell you which tape, but I'm too lazy to look right now.


Volume 1.
JNeal
View Profile
Inner circle
I used to have 999 posts, now I have
1528 Posts

Profile of JNeal
I think Vernon may have had some inspiration from a magician he much admired: Tenkai. In the book " The Thoughts of Tenkai (Tenkai Prize committee 1970?) the author Masatoshi Furota teaches something quite similar!
visit me @ JNealShow.com
DrVG
View Profile
Regular user
143 Posts

Profile of DrVG
Quote:
On Sep 15, 2015, JNeal wrote:
I think Vernon may have had some inspiration from a magician he much admired: Tenkai. In the book " The Thoughts of Tenkai (Tenkai Prize committee 1970?) the author Masatoshi Furota teaches something quite similar!


I take the liberty to quote this japanese website (google translate) : http://plaza.harmonix.ne.jp/~k-miwa/magi......ver.html

dai vernon came up with the idea for this routine in the 1930s. when amami ishida went to the united states before the war, he commented that he also received advice from amami. in fact, the handling of the part indicating that the hand is empty is exactly what amamishi seems to think about. amamishi is also greatly influenced by vernon, so it is probably a "masterpiece" that such geniuses have come up with ideas with each other.

even so, if you are a person who is doing magic, such as the part where you transfer coins from the right hand to the left hand and to the right hand many times in a natural operation, you will be impressed only by that. not on purpose, but all the action is natural. "it looks like you're not doing anything, but it's a strange phenomenon." I think this is the ideal as magic. it's ok to do something difficult behind the scenes, but it's an absolute requirement to be able to do it without making the audience feel it. it is more important to have a better sensibility in the part of how to look natural rather than overcome with practice. it's not just about doing something difficult.

I think that it is difficult to understand the area only by the book, so we recommend that you refer to the video. Vernon and Amer do it in Vol.5 of Vernon Revelations. When I watch this video and see Vernon giving Amer some detailed advice, I'm even more thrilled to see how detailed Vernon is thinking about it.

phenomenon

Silk and Silver 2three coins (half dollar) appear one by one from a well-fledged handkerchief (silk).

spread your handkerchief in the palm of your hand and put three coins on top of it. hold the four corners of the handkerchief and make it like a bag. when you shake the handkerchief up and down, the coin bounces inside, and there is also a sound.

however, if you shake the handkerchief and spread it, all the coins will disappear. there are no coins in the hand or in the handkerchief. three coins will disappear like they fall into the air.

put the handkerchief in the shape of a bag again and hold it on your left hand. pointing in the air with your right hand will spawn a coin. throw it up into the air and you'll make an invisible flight and jump into your handkerchief. the second piece is made to appear in the same way, and it is made to jump into the handkerchief. the third piece is made to fly "as seen" and put it in the handkerchief.

comment

in motomachi shopping street in kobe, there was a shop that sold magic tools as well as miscellaneous goods. the owner here was good at almost the same magic. I myself went to this store in the mid-1970s. at that time, I could not show it, but one piece of paper explaining how to do it was sold for 100 yen. at that time, it was already in a state that seemed to be worn out, so I understand that it was sold for quite some time. at that time, speaking of magic manuals sold on the street, it usually only has the principle of thetane, and I do not know anything such as detailed handling. it is absolutely not possible even if the general public reads it. even people who do a lot of magic are incomprehensible first. I understood the principle, but it was impossible just to read it.

in later years, when I learned of vernon's routine, I compared it, and after bagging the handkerchief, I used a fan to show that there was a coin inside, and then struck under the handkerchief and made a sound. it is unclear whether this has anything to do with vernon's procedures or was developed entirely independently. perhaps, when amakai returned home once before the war, what he showed to someone might have spread in japan.

vernon's routine has also had a huge impact on fred cups. cups himself learned directly from vernon, plus cups' own handling, on stage.

THE VERNON CHRONICLES VOLUME ONE; IT ISon THE LOST INNER SECRETS(by Stephen Minch, L&L Publishing).

additional comments (february 26, 2000): the stores in kobe mentioned above are no longer available. mr. yasutoshi fukuoka of the osaka bijutsu lovers association, who is the same as me, learned this magic from the owner, mr. sumi, when he was in elementary school. it seems to be more than 50 years ago from now.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Silk & Silver--Where can I learn this? (1 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2022 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.25 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL